What a horrible time for our economy

[theknife]

Originally Posted by Ðiego

If you don't believe the Iraq invasion, or that our spending 10 bullion dollars a month there now, are mistakes then I question your judgment as much as I question McCains. Why are we spending 10 billion dollars a month on a country which is sitting on untold billions of barrels of oil?

well, the answer to that question should be clear as a fucking bell at this point: so we can control thier oil. all the rest of that "freedom is on the march" and "spreading democracy" bullshit were fairy tales and window dressing to sell this train wreck to feebleminded neocon Bushbots.

edit: and btw, Obama is distinctly juking right, imo, no doubt to broaden his appeal for the GE. his recent comments on Iraq as well his disinclination to hold the line on the FISA bill and telecom immunity are not encouraging. it's a shame coz he really doesn't have to water down his brand to carry this election - apparently, he thinks otherwise.

[Ðiego]

Aye, no-bid contracts given to only Western oil companies and, surprise surprise, a no-bid contract given to Halliburton for firefighting in Iraq.

More of the same 'you lick my ass I'll lick yours' we've come to expect.


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[albed]

"We're going to try this again. Apparently I wasn't clear enough this morning on my position with respect to the war in Iraq.

Let me be as clear as I can be: I intend to end this war.

Ooooh, so it's an "intention" instead of a "pledge". That's so much more.....


worthless.

My first day in office I will bring the Joint Chiefs of Staff in and I will give them a new mission, and that is to end this war -- responsibly, deliberately but decisively.

Well this sounds like a replacement pledge. Let's see how long before it becomes another "intention".

This is the same position I that had four months ago. It's the same position that I had eight months ago. It's the same position that I had 12 months ago."

Yeah, yeah but the poor suckers can only hear what you say, not what "position" you secretly hold.




Enjoy your new status of Obama bitchhood.

Now bend over.

[Ðiego]

You're so uninformed that I'm often surprised you even know the names of the candidates.

Nice to see PA is going blue Also nice to see that Jesse Helms finially got his first class ticket to hell.


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[Mazer]

Originally Posted by theknife

it's a shame coz he really doesn't have to water down his brand to carry this election - apparently, he thinks otherwise.

This isn't his first rodeo, he knows he needs to move to the middle in order to get elected.

[albed]

Ah come on now Mazer, tell him nobody's going to change their vote based on Obama's weaseling out on his pledges and promises.

[theknife]

Originally Posted by Mazer

This isn't his first rodeo, he knows he needs to move to the middle in order to get elected.

no, i don't think he does - not this election cycle. the GOP brand is so badly trashed at this point (or, as Virginia GOP Congressman Tom Davis puts it: "if we were dog food, they would take us off the shelf"), and Democratic voter ID is so high, that he could stick to his guns and still get elected. of course, he'll play it safe and shift center-right, but i don't think he necessarily has to, at least not this time around.

[Ðiego]

In a major shift in policy today, Barack Obama, who has vowed all election season to have a salad instead ordered a large bowl of lettuce along with tomato slices, cucumbers, carrot shavings, a hard boiled egg, with cut up pieces of ham, salami and cheese.

The Republican party understandably jumped on this shocking change in strategy!

[Mazer]

Originally Posted by theknife

no, i don't think he does - not this election cycle. the GOP brand is so badly trashed at this point (or, as Virginia GOP Congressman Tom Davis puts it: "if we were dog food, they would take us off the shelf"), and Democratic voter ID is so high, that he could stick to his guns and still get elected. of course, he'll play it safe and shift center-right, but i don't think he necessarily has to, at least not this time around.

Then he can stop campaigning, can't he? He's already clinched the Democratic nomination, now all he has to do is sit back and wait until January 20th. Of course, he won't, apparently he knows something you don't.

[theknife]

Originally Posted by Mazer

Then he can stop campaigning, can't he? He's already clinched the Democratic nomination, now all he has to do is sit back and wait until January 20th. Of course, he won't, apparently he knows something you don't.

not quite, you've got it backwards: apparently, i know something he doesn't.

[albed]

Win a lot of elections in your day knife?

If Obama's flip-flops start negatively affecting poll results he'll certainly flop-flip back to your preferred tunes; but since he has all your lips firmly locked to his ass now your opinions mean nothing and he's gone looking for new listeners.

[Ðiego]

I notice you constantly talk of Obama's 'flip-flops' and yet never say what they are, or why you think they are 'flip-flops', and you never mention McCain's 'flop-flops'; why is that?

Oh, and the term 'flop-flop' itself isn't actually a term, it's a 'meme' invented by the GOP.

McCain has reversed his stance on every one of his purported 'core issues' and his 'Straight talk Express' has become the 'Bullshit Express'. I challenge you to find any issues which McCain hasn't, in your terms, 'flip-flopped' on.


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[albed]

OMG, I don't post what Diego wants!


What is wrong with me?


I only post what I want!



WHY?




WHYYYY?

[Ðiego]

I take that as a 'no' on all fronts then?

No, you don't know the issues. No, you don't know who has changed from what they said before to what they say now. No, you don't care that average incomes have dropped while average profits are up. No, you haven't noticed that the stock markets have dropped 400 points on 2000 totals. No, you can't be bothered to see for yourself what has been going on in your name by a government hell-bent on building trillion-dollar deficits of debt to Saudi Arabia and China.

That's okay, Bush has taught you that you need not expose yourself needlessly to the truth in matters which effect you. It will all be just fine, the GOP is looking out for your best interests and knows better than you what those are..


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[Mazer]

It isn't that Obama flip-flops, he's actually been rather consistent in his short political career. But when situations arise in which he must change or face ridicule, he's very good at spinning the situation to make his calculated political maneuvers look like self improvement. Take the Reverend Wright story for example. Obama never actually repudiated Wright for his racist sermons, instead he used the hypothetical article 'if' to describe situations that would make him embarrassed to be associated with that bigot. His association with Wright hasn't changed in any way, but Obama has successfully quashed all the negative connotations of that association. To observers it looks like he has changed, but he manages to maintain his image of consistency while undergoing those changes, something few politicians can pull off. Obama's true strength is accentuating the positive sides of his inconsistencies. He is, in fact, a new breed of politician, one who is able to pander without looking like he's pandering. I wonder if our government would be better or worse off if more politicians were like him.

[Ðiego]

We've heard much worse than Wright from white religious assholes and no one has condemned them. We've heard worse from helms and he was in government.

Obama faces the same BS the GOP always puts out: if you don't adjust you're stuck in your ways and if you do then you're a 'flip-flopper'. While at the same time their candidate does what he likes.

Not only that, but the GOP likes to accuse their rivals of that which they are about to do. Clark goes on the news praising McCain's military service and calling him a hero then he disagrees with the interviewer that McCain being shot down is an instant qualification to be president and so the GOP accuse him of slandering McCain's military career, which he didn't, by slandering Clark's military career. And the media ate it up.

Ever notice how the McCain camp claims that Obama has the media wrapped around his finger, while they have the media wrapped around McCain's finger? Even the AP is now pushing McCain's talking points. It's pathetic.


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[Mazer]

Of course, by deconstructing Obama's political strategies I'm not suggesting that his opponents don't also dance the dance. It isn't necessary for you to point out McCain's flaws, I see them too and I don't like them either. I haven't decided who to vote for yet so you can end the lecturing for now.

Originally Posted by Ðiego

Ever notice how the McCain camp claims that Obama has the media wrapped around his finger, while they have the media wrapped around McCain's finger? Even the AP is now pushing McCain's talking points. It's pathetic.

I've noticed that the media has the candidates wrapped around its finger. Nobody gets elected in this country without media exposure so McCain and Obama both are at the beckon call of program directors and chief editors in all the news rooms across the nation. Some politicians make the best of it while others struggle with it.

[Ðiego]

I didn't realize I was lecturing, I thought we were having a discussion?


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[Mazer]

Maybe you haven't noticed the pattern, but I have. Every time someone says something about Obama that isn't praise, you say something about McCain to condemn him. I haven't been comparing Obama to McCain but you respond to me as if I have. It's a little annoying.

[Ðiego]

Isn't that the nature of conversation? Comparing the candidates is what I like to do, and I dislike the GOP for several reasons. I used to vote Republican, but after Homeland Security, Patriot Act I & II, invasion of Iraq, etc, etc, I can't support them any longer.

If I'm ramming Obama down your throat then my apologies m8. wasn't my intention though I see now I prolly was.


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