Russ Feingold to Help Republicans Move on To Stage 2: Anger

[RDixon]

"In the United States of America, the people are sovereign, not the President. It is Congress’ responsibility to challenge an administration that persists in a war that is misguided and that the country opposes. We cannot simply wring our hands and complain about the Administration’s policy. We cannot just pass resolutions saying “your policy is mistaken.” And we can’t stand idly by and tell ourselves that it’s the President’s job to fix the mess he made. It’s our job to fix the mess, and if we don’t do so we are abdicating our responsibilities.

Tomorrow, I will introduce legislation that will prohibit the use of funds to continue the deployment of U.S. forces in Iraq six months after enactment. By prohibiting funds after a specific deadline, Congress can force the President to bring our forces out of Iraq and out of harm’s way. "

http://www.fdlreporter.com/apps/pbcs.../70130043/1985

Let the games begin...

[theknife]

the GOP wants to filibuster or otherwise block any anti-war resolution. i hope they do - let 'em stand up and be counted as standing squarely behind Bush and his war. with almost 70% percent of the public against the war, it's helpful to have a stark reminder of who is listening to whom.

[albed]

That's not an "anti-war resolution" bubbles, it's an oddly courageous and effective "action" that's hardly believable given the dems record of empty rhetoric.

No doubt they have plans to assure that that legislation will fail to pass and they'll remain consistant with their past behaviour.

And their dim-witted supporters will cheer the "effort".

[Mazer]

They'll either do what they think is right or they'll do what they think will get them reelected. Sure, you'd rather the government wimped out and caved to public opinion, but is that any way for a republic to behave?



Buncha cowards runnin' this country.

[Sinner]

Originally Posted by Mazer

They'll either do what they think is right or they'll do what they think will get them reelected. Sure, you'd rather the government wimped out and caved to public opinion, but is that any way for a republic to behave?



Buncha cowards runnin' this country.

Amen to that,

Problem is, politicians right now have to scramble to survive the bad press and opinion polls because for the last 200 years Americans grow weary if a war goes on for more then 3 years. This is the point when they want to pull up their skirts and run away. Most of Iraq is in peace, the northern and the southern areas. It is the Sunni Arab minority who still support the attackes to try and restore a Sunni Arab dictatorship. All that is happening is you have partisans not accurately describing the terror campaign and opposition politicians taking advantage of the situation, this has nothing to do with Iraq. It has everything to do with local politics in the United States.

[RDixon]

"I listened carefully to the President's remarks at a news conference that he held earlier today. I heard nothing in his discussion of the issue that would persuade me that further U.S. military involvement in the area is necessary. In fact, his remarks have persuaded me more profoundly that we should leave and leave soon.

Dates certain, Mr. President, are not the criteria here. What is the criteria and what should be the criteria is our immediate, orderly withdrawal from Somalia. And if we do not do that and other Americans die, other Americans are wounded, other Americans are captured because we stay too long--longer than necessary--then I would say that the responsibilities for that lie with the Congress of the United States who did not exercise their authority under the Constitution of the United States and mandate that they be brought home quickly and safely as possible." - Sen. John McCain - October 19,1993

On President Clinton's Somalia disaster which ultimately cost Les Aspen his job as Sec Def.
Russ Feingold was in complete agreement with McCain.

Feingold's position today is the same.

McCain's?

Waffle waffle...

Congress not only can, but WILL end the Bush disaster in Iraq, one way or another... and if Bush "decides" to make it a constitutional crisis, he will lose; possibly his job.

CSPAN viewership numbers will be increasing in the coming few months, I predict.

[Mazer]

Nah, C-SPAN's viewership could increase 1000% and they'd still have poor ratings. But I'm betting NPR's audience will double in size. In fact any news outlet could increase its ratings just by implying that Iraq is a mess and Bush is a failure, and if they're interested in increasing their advertising rates then that's exactly what they'll do. Due to the increase in negative reporting the public will be tricked into thinking things are far worse than they actually are, and eventually reporting bad news all the time will become so profitable that it will become utterly impossible to tell what's really going on. At that point reality will be replaced by what some people call hyperreality, an entirely fictitious construct that most people cannot distinguish from the real thing. Mass delusion ensues.

Or has that already happened?

But all that aside, McCain is being a good Republican now as he was then, and his buddy Feingold is no different. I hate to say it but the only guy with any guts at all—besides Bush—is Joe Lieberman. The rest are all politicians, and you can't expect any elected official to stick to his guns in a place like Washington, D.C.

[theknife]

what good is guts without competence?

[RDixon]

Can't say as I blame you fot hating to say something when all the facts and all the evidence points to the exact opposite being true.

Unless, of course, by guts, you mean cowardly stubborness.

edit: C-Span's viewership doubled today. I watched it for a few hours.

[albed]

By guts he means the determination of a person to stick to his convictions(guns) instead of yielding to what others want.

Non-liberals actually find that trait admirable. Liberals, of course, find it incomprehensible.







Sometimes guts is enough.

[miss_silver]

Originally Posted by Mazer

but is that any way for a republic to behave?

Yes it is. Somehow I just heard the very faint echo of Lincoln words ...and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.

Now that is a republic.

In Canada, ex MP Paul Martin was overthrown because of the corruption of his party and the sponsorship scandals, this year it's MP Harper's turn, that brown noser will be overthrown by a no confidence vote sometime this spring. Canadians are pissed to see good soldiers, good men come back in coffins from afghanistan.

The people have spoken, bring our troops back home.

Of the people, by the people, for the people

[theknife]

Originally Posted by albed

Sometimes guts is enough.

yup. but not this time. and without competence or brains,of course, it's just foolishness. neocon ideologues find this incomprehensible.

[RDixon]

Originally Posted by albed

By guts he means the determination of a person to stick to his convictions(guns) instead of yielding to what others want.

Non-liberals actually find that trait admirable. Liberals, of course, find it incomprehensible.

Sometimes guts is enough.

So, you and other non-liberals admired Saddam, Hitler, Pol Pot, et.el?
Good to see you coming out of the closet and admiting to your shortcomings.

And when it comes to Bush, it is odd indeed that you would choose to use the word convictions...

Meanwhile, the topic is...

[JackSpratts]

bush? guts? hell, how would anyone know? he's never put himself in harms way. not during vietnam and not now.

this is a guy who regularly puts others in danger but not himself.

the only heat he might take is printed criticism - but he doesn't read inside the papers ("i see the headlines.") so he avoids even that.

he recently spent large sums of your money to have his little situation room all tricked out with comfy leather chairs and slick flat screen tvs so he could conference in james bondian comfort - while the troops are getting their asses blown out of broiling humvees on the other side of the world.

nah, this twerp doesn't have guts, and we know he doesn't have brains. just a reptilian sense of self preservation combined with a patholigical delusion there is a god and he's been annointed by him.

guts. christ that's a laugh.

- js.

[RDixon]

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...ts&btnG=Search

[Sinner]

There is a clip going around, youtube will have it, where military troops in Iraq are being interviewed about the situation in Iraq. Most of the soldiers responded saying how they were tired of people saying they support the troops but oppose the war, they are frustrated with the lies of the media and how the American public veiws their efforts to bring people a better way of living, their effort to bring democracy to a place where murder, rape, etc against the majority ran rampunt.

The liberals did not like this one bit, take William M Arkin of the Washington Post for example. Seems he thinks the troops should shut up because the nation is tired of feeding them and supporting their blood lust.

--“ So, we pay the soldiers a decent wage, take care of their families, provide them with housing and medical care and vast social support systems and ship obscene amenities into the war zone for them, we support them in every possible way, and their attitude is that we should in addition roll over and play dead, defer to the military and the generals and let them fight their war, and give up our rights and responsibilities to speak up because they are above society?”—


http://blog.washingtonpost.com/early...to_suppor.html

Read The comments at the bottom of his article aswell.


Oh, and someone said Canadians are pissed we are in Afghanistan. That should say French Canadians not Canadians. Spring election was kinda funny too….cute post.

[Mazer]

You're right, Jack, the only thing at stake for most politicians is public image. This doesn't mean they are without conscience, that the deaths of thousands of Americans does not weigh heavily on their minds. I have no doubt that politicians on both sides want to save as many lives as possible. Miraculously, they can have such desires without ever knowing how rough a soldier's life really is. Being pushed outside of your comfort zone and having your life threatened is not a prerequisite for being commander in chief, though often that is a consequence of becoming president as 18 of them well know. A few new leather chairs and TV's won't actually make Bush more comfortable, Jack, they'll only reduce visits to the chiropractor and optometrist.

And as for his level of intelligence, until you show me his certified I.Q. and it's below 100, you're full of hot air. He's the most well informed an best advised person in the world. His perceived lack of competence is nothing more than the public's lack of confidence in him and I trust his gut more than your's.

Originally Posted by RDixon

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q...ts&btnG=Search

Clever.

[Mazer]

Originally Posted by miss_silver

Yes it is. Somehow I just heard the very faint echo of Lincoln words ...and that government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not perish from the earth.

Now that is a republic.

A republic is a small group of people that governs the rest of the population with the mandate of that population. We have democratic elections but that does not make us a democracy, and because we are not a democracy our government should not flip flop in response to public opinion polls. A republic that pretends to be a democracy is having a crisis of identity and needs to get its act together. It needs representatives who stick to the promises that got them elected in the first place.

Lincoln was a Republican, by the way. He would not have approved of our leaders consulting opinion polls after they were elected.

[albed]

Originally Posted by JackSpratts

bush? guts? hell, how would anyone know? he's never put himself in harms way. not during vietnam and not now.

this is a guy who regularly puts others in danger but not himself.

the only heat he might take is printed criticism - but he doesn't read inside the papers ("i see the headlines.") so he avoids even that.

he recently spent large sums of your money to have his little situation room all tricked out with comfy leather chairs and slick flat screen tvs so he could conference in james bondian comfort - while the troops are getting their asses blown out of broiling humvees on the other side of the world.

nah, this twerp doesn't have guts, and we know he doesn't have brains. just a reptilian sense of self preservation combined with a patholigical delusion there is a god and he's been annointed by him.

guts. christ that's a laugh.

- js.

Lmao; it's like a flailing temper tantrum thrown by a two year old who doesn't get his way.


Bush made his promises and commitments and he's standing by them. Unlike so many others.


I think Bush will go down in history as "President Guts".

[JackSpratts]

Originally Posted by Mazer

His perceived lack of competence is nothing more than the public's lack of confidence in him.

hehe. i read some of your latest stuff mazer and burst out laughing. "nothing more." good one lol, but re iraq you can't back up nor provide evidence for.

it's pure fantasy. well, delusion actually.

i don't hold it against you. we all have ours. no one takes yours seriously (except the christian right and even they are backing away) and most importantly you're not sending kids off to die, but it is increasingly disconnected from reality.

- js.

edit. i just saw albed's pout. "president guts" is even zanier than "nothing more."