P2P-Zone  

Go Back   P2P-Zone > Political Asylum
FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Political Asylum Publicly Debate Politics, War, Media.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 29-02-04, 08:44 AM   #1
theknife
my name is Ranking Fullstop
 
theknife's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Promontorium Tremendum
Posts: 4,391
Default $10,000 Unclaimed...

i don't think Kerry or Bush's activities, vis a vis military service 30 years ago, are particularly relevant, but it's interesting that a $10,000 reward to anyone who actually saw Bush in Guard Service has gone unclaimed ....

Quote:
No Dice for Doonesbury
More than 1,300 people have responded to the Doonesbury comic strip's request for proof that President Bush did, in fact, serve in the Alabama National Guard during the Vietnam War. The first respondent to cough up credible evidence will receive a $10,000 reward in the form of a donation to the USO, which entertains U.S. troops. But, so far, the contest has yielded little fruit. "A credible witness would have turned up by now if there was one," said Doonesbury creator Garry Trudeau. If one should crop up, the cartoonist plans to pay the $10,000 out of his own pocket, even though he admits it's "counterintuitive" for him to offer this support to the Dems. After all, Trudeau says, President Bush is "God's gift to cartoonists."
imo, the only thing that might make these activities a real issue is if somebody is lying about what they did or didn't do back then...
theknife is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 09:42 AM   #2
span
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,260
Default

ScrappleFace Offers $10 for Proof Doonesbury is 'Comic'

(2004-02-25) -- Scott Ott, editor-in-chief of the daily news satire site ScrappleFace.com, today announced a $10 reward to anyone who could prove that Doonesbury is a "comic" strip.

The lucrative contest comes in response to an offer by Doonesbury creator Garry Trudeau to donate $10,000 to the U.S.O. on behalf of anyone who could prove that George W. Bush served in the Alabama Air National Guard. Mr. Bush now serves as Commander-in-Chief of all U.S. military forces.

Mr. Ott challenged the readers of ScrappleFace to prove that Doonesbury fits the following definition of "comic"...
1) of, relating to, or marked by comedy;
2) causing laughter or amusement;
3) FUNNY

Proof may be posted in the comment section under this item. The winning reader will receive the $10 prize via PayPal, and the winner's name will be posted at ScrappleFace.com.
span is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 09:49 AM   #3
JackSpratts
 
JackSpratts's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: New England
Posts: 9,927
Default

"So don't let the smear artists define the president. If you personally witnessed George W. Bush reporting for drills at Dannelly Air National Guard Base between the months of May and November of 1972 we want to hear about it. Help Mr. Bush put this partisan assault on his character behind him, so he can focus on more serious issues like jobs, the deficit and the coming civil war in Iraq."

rewards have been offered - and uncollected - since 2000. lol god, that trudeau 's a laugh riot, hehe.

mr. ott owes me a tenner. he can donate it to the reps. they'll need it this year.

- js.
JackSpratts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 12:07 PM   #4
theknife
my name is Ranking Fullstop
 
theknife's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Promontorium Tremendum
Posts: 4,391
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by JackSpratts
"... the coming civil war in Iraq."

rewards have been offered - and uncollected - since 2000. lol god, that trudeau 's a laugh riot, hehe.
- js.
Trudeau is not only usually funny and frequently hilarious, he is often amazingly prescient. considering his strips are drawn well in advance of their publication, it's amazing how timely and right-up-to-the minute relevant they are upon publication
theknife is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 03:51 PM   #5
span
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,260
Default

i think the fact he was honorably discharged shows that he completed his duty. and that fact is indisputable without resorting to the time honored crutch of the left; "his daddy helped him", which again is something the left has no proof of but they circulate as fact.
span is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 04:59 PM   #6
scooobiedooobie
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 381
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by JackSpratts
rewards have been offered - and uncollected - since 2000. lol god, that trudeau 's a laugh riot, hehe.

mr. ott owes me a tenner. he can donate it to the reps. they'll need it this year.
you know, it's kind of amazing how all of a sudden the very people who most loathe the military and everything it represents.. are now so concerned about who served when and where and for how long.

the fact is bush was honorably discharged without ever being officially accused of desertion, or being away without official leave.

http://factcheck.org/article.aspx?docID=131
scooobiedooobie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 05:04 PM   #7
theknife
my name is Ranking Fullstop
 
theknife's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Promontorium Tremendum
Posts: 4,391
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by span
i think the fact he was honorably discharged shows that he completed his duty. and that fact is indisputable without resorting to the time honored crutch of the left; "his daddy helped him", which again is something the left has no proof of but they circulate as fact.
the fact that he was honorably discharged means that he got a piece of paper. as to his actual service, funny how nobody's memory can be jogged to recall him on duty - even with a $10,000 incentive
theknife is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 06:52 PM   #8
span
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,260
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by theknife
the fact that he was honorably discharged means that he got a piece of paper. as to his actual service, funny how nobody's memory can be jogged to recall him on duty - even with a $10,000 incentive
not remembering some non-descript officer 30+ years ago isn't exactly inconcievable or cause for suspicion.
span is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 07:17 PM   #9
theknife
my name is Ranking Fullstop
 
theknife's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Promontorium Tremendum
Posts: 4,391
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by span
not remembering some non-descript officer 30+ years ago isn't exactly inconcievable or cause for suspicion.
of course not.

it's not like the non-descript officer was the son of a US congressman and later went on to be President of the United States - who'd remember someone like that? and it's not as if the non-descript officer later, as president, developed a credibility gap the size of the Grand Canyon between what he says and what's actually going on...who'd be suspicious about a guy like that?

the nerve of some people, huh?
theknife is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 07:28 PM   #10
span
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,260
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by theknife
of course not.

it's not like the non-descript officer was the son of a US congressman and later went on to be President of the United States - who'd remember someone like that? and it's not as if the non-descript officer later, as president, developed a credibility gap the size of the Grand Canyon between what he says and what's actually going on...who'd be suspicious about a guy like that?

the nerve of some people, huh?
again your utter stupidity shines on

i went to school with my mayors daughter and i can't remember a damn thing about her, and that was only 8 years ago.
span is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 08:09 PM   #11
theknife
my name is Ranking Fullstop
 
theknife's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Promontorium Tremendum
Posts: 4,391
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by span
again your utter stupidity shines on

i went to school with my mayors daughter and i can't remember a damn thing about her, and that was only 8 years ago.

and did your mayor's daughter go on to become President?

i think not

c'mon Spannie...let's come down to earth for a minute. if you had ever spent any time anywhere with someone who later went on to become President of the United States, do you really think you and every single person else who was there with you would have no recollection of it?

i think not

perhaps if he actually had served, he would have been more circumspect about sending other young men off to die, no?
theknife is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 08:31 PM   #12
span
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,260
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by theknife
and did your mayor's daughter go on to become President?

i think not

c'mon Spannie...let's come down to earth for a minute. if you had ever spent any time anywhere with someone who later went on to become President of the United States, do you really think you and every single person else who was there with you would have no recollection of it?

i think not

perhaps if he actually had served, he would have been more circumspect about sending other young men off to die, no?
you fail to see the the point as usual. George Bush isn't a very memorable name, if, 30 years ago i meet a man name Bush i wouldn't remember him if he became the fucking Pope later in his life.

do you think he ran around base with a large sign on his back that said "FUTURE PRESIDENT OF THE USA" pinned to his back?
span is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 09:13 PM   #13
theknife
my name is Ranking Fullstop
 
theknife's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Promontorium Tremendum
Posts: 4,391
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by span
you fail to see the the point as usual. George Bush isn't a very memorable name, if, 30 years ago i meet a man name Bush i wouldn't remember him if he became the fucking Pope later in his life.

do you think he ran around base with a large sign on his back that said "FUTURE PRESIDENT OF THE USA" pinned to his back?

so, no one remember's a man who goes on to become president because he was so nondescript or no one remembers him coz he wasn't there?

protip: think Occam's Razor
theknife is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 09:20 PM   #14
span
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,260
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by theknife
so, no one remember's a man who goes on to become president because he was so nondescript or no one remembers him coz he wasn't there?

protip: think Occam's Razor
well the honorable discharge proves he fulfilled his duties there so you really only have one choice.
span is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 09:43 PM   #15
scooobiedooobie
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 381
Default

why don't we look at john "I served in vietnam" kerry’s war record?


By THOMAS LIPSCOMB Mr. Lipscomb, the founder of Times Books, was the publisher of Admiral Zumwalt’s best-selling book, “On Watch.”

Senator Kerry recently wrote a letter to President Bush complaining, “You and your campaign have initiated a widespread attack on my service in Vietnam, my decision to speak out to end that war,” and warning, “I will not sit back and allow my patriotism to be challenged.”

In the absence of any evidence from Mr. Kerry of an attack from the Bush campaign, Mr. Kerry seems to have originated his own doctrine of “pre-emption.” How valid are his concerns?

No one denies Mr. Kerry’s four bemedaled months in “Swiftboats” or his seven-months’ service as an electrical officer on board the USS Gridley, during its cruises back and forth to California, or even his months as an admiral’s aide in Brooklyn, before he was able get out of the Navy six months early to run for office.

Taking a look at Mr. Kerry’s much-promoted Vietnam service, his military record was, indeed, remarkable in many ways. Last week, the former assistant secretary of defense and Fletcher School of Diplomacy professor,W. Scott Thompson, recalled a conversation with the late Admiral Elmo R. Zumwalt Jr. that clearly had a slightly different take on Mr. Kerry’s recollection of their discussions:

“[T]he fabled and distinguished chief of naval operations,Admiral Elmo Zumwalt,told me — 30 years ago when he was still CNO —that during his own command of U.S. naval forces in Vietnam,just prior to his anointment as CNO, young Kerry had created great problems for him and the other top brass,by killing so many non-combatant civilians and going after other non-military targets.‘We had virtually to straitjacket him to keep him under control,’ the admiral said. ‘Bud’ Zumwalt got it right when he assessed Kerry as having large ambitions — but promised that his career in Vietnam would haunt him if he were ever on the national stage.” And this statement was made despite the fact Zumwalt had personally pinned a Silver Star on Mr. Kerry.

Mr. Kerry was assigned to Swiftboat 44 on December 1, 1968. Within 24 hours, he had his first Purple Heart. Mr. Kerry accumulated three Purple Hearts in four months with not even a day of duty lost from wounds, according to his training officer. It’s a pity one cannot read his Purple Heart medical treatment reports which have been withheld from the public. The only person preventing their release is Mr. Kerry.

By his own admission during those four months, Mr. Kerry continually kept ramming his Swiftboat onto an enemy-held shore on assorted occasions alone and with a few men, killing civilians and even a wounded enemy soldier. One can begin to appreciate Zumwalt’s problem with Mr. Kerry as commander of an unarmored craft dependent upon speed of maneuver to keep it and its crew from being shot to pieces.

Mr. Kerry now refers to those civilian deaths as “accidents of war.”And within four days of his third Purple Heart, Mr. Kerry applied to take advantage of a technicality which allowed him to request immediate transfer to a stateside post.

Once back in the States, Mr. Kerry joined “the struggle for our veterans,” as he called it last week in Atlanta, by joining a scruffy organization called the Vietnam Veterans Against the War. The VVAW’s executive director, Al Hubbard, supposedly a former Air Force captain wounded in Vietnam, quickly appointed Mr. Kerry to the executive committee.

Mr. Kerry participated with the VVAW at agitprop rallies such as Valley Forge and the “Winter Soldier” guerrilla theater atrocity trials in Detroit, finally testifying in April 1971 before the Senate as an authority on the war crimes his fellow American servicemen had committed in Vietnam.

Outside of his own “accidents of war,” there is no evidence that Mr. Kerry had then or has now the least idea what may or may not have been the realities of ground combat. However, he had no problem reeling off for the Senate a series of unproven, secondhand allegations that would have been perfectly at home at the Nuremberg trials indicting his fellow veterans.

Mr. Kerry stated there were “war crimes committed in Southeast Asia...not isolated incidents but crimes committed on a day-today basis with the full awareness of officers at all levels of command.They relived the absolute horror of what this country, in a sense, made them do.”Then Mr. Kerry got specific:

“They had personally raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, taped wires from portable telephones to human genitals and turned up the power, cut off limbs, blown up bodies, randomly shot at civilians, razed villages in fashion reminiscent of Genghis Khan, shot cattle and dogs for fun, poisoned food stocks, and generally ravaged the countryside of South Vietnam...we are more guilty than any other body of violations of those Geneva Conventions; in the use of free-fire zones, harassment interdiction fire, search-and-destroy missions,the bombings,the torture of prisoners, all accepted policy by many units in South Vietnam.”

In other words, My Lai was just another day in the life of the Vietnam War.

This wasn’t a one-time occasion. The VVAW had been peddling this line from the day Mr. Kerry joined them and had been publishing charges like this for the previous two years. Mr. Kerry repeated them on “Meet the Press” with Al Hubbard, who was found to be a total fraud and who never served in Vietnam, much less was wounded. However, Mr. Kerry has never renounced the charges he made.

Recently, his fellow VVAW supporter, Jane Fonda, has tried to minimize a potentially damaging picture of him a few rows behind her at the three-day VVAW Valley Forge rally in September 1970.And many members of the press fell for the line that it was accidental or coincidental,including Fox’s Chris Wallace and ABC’s Tim Russert.

However, there were only eight or nine speakers that day, including Donald Sutherland, Mark Lane, Bella Abzug, and Ms. Fonda. And far from being a casual audience member, Mr. Kerry, an executive committee member, not Ms. Fonda, was the lead speaker.

Ms. Fonda had been funding VVAW events since before Mr. Kerry joined its executive committee. At Valley Forge, Ms. Fonda said: “…My Lai was not an isolated incident but rather a way of life for many of our military.”

Their appearance together in that picture may be a lot of things, but it was not a coincidence.

Mr. Kerry has already confessed his complicity in killing civilians as “accidents of war.”However, he has offered a classic Nuremberg defense that this was not only a commonplace occurrence throughout the Vietnam War, but he was carrying out a policy “with the full awareness of officers at all levels of command.”

His commander of naval operations in Vietnam, who specifically designed the mission that Mr. Kerry and the other Swiftboat commanders executed, Admiral Zumwalt, clearly disagreed. An examination of the truth behind this disagreement is not an attack on Mr. Kerry. It is a matter of vital historical interest.

http://daily.nysun.com/Repository/ge.../27&ID=Ar00800

Quote:
Originally posted by theknife
perhaps if he actually had served, he would have been more circumspect about sending other young men off to die, no?
oh...you mean like bill "i'm a draft dodger" clinton did?
scooobiedooobie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 09:50 PM   #16
JackSpratts
 
JackSpratts's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: New England
Posts: 9,927
Default

the guys at the time knew about bush. the guardsmen were "waiting for this famous celebrity son of a texas congressman" to show up - and they "never saw him" (the natguards' words, not mine.) they remember waiting for him, they remember never seeing him and they remember wondering where the hell he was (and if maybe his daddy pulled strings). they knew they couldn't just take a few months off whenever they felt like...and they sure as hell knew they themselves couldn't just not show up at all. these guys remember thinking it was mighty strange.

the argument that bush was somehow "nondescript" isn’t true. while i fully agree that he himself has much to be modest about, his position in life preceded him, particularly in the guard at that time. this new argument that no one remembers him because he was invisible is more loony psyops from the hardright, sitting behind their pc's, laughing at their own bs and anyone on the left gullible enough to give it even the slightest consideration. pure codswallop, the gasps of the truly desperate. that they now stoop to attack kerry, himself a true hero in actual combat no less, illuminates thier moral bankruptcy.

- js.
JackSpratts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 10:11 PM   #17
scooobiedooobie
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 381
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by JackSpratts
pure codswallop, the gasps of the truly desperate. that they now stoop to attack kerry, himself a true hero...
lol, kerry..a true hero?? pure codswallop, the gasps of the truly desperate!
scooobiedooobie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 10:36 PM   #18
span
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,260
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by JackSpratts
that they now stoop to attack kerry, himself a true hero in actual combat no less, illuminates thier moral bankruptcy.

- js.
http://www.villagevoice.com/video/nyc-vets-02-28-04.php

and

http://daily.nysun.com/Repository/ge.../27&ID=Ar00800

Quote:
Taking a look at Mr. Kerry’s much-promoted Vietnam service, his military record was, indeed, remarkable in many ways. Last week, the former assistant secretary of defense and Fletcher School of Diplomacy professor,W. Scott Thompson, recalled a conversation with the late Admiral Elmo R. Zumwalt Jr. that clearly had a slightly different take on Mr. Kerry’s recollection of their discussions:

“[T]he fabled and distinguished chief of naval operations,Admiral Elmo Zumwalt,told me — 30 years ago when he was still CNO —that during his own command of U.S. naval forces in Vietnam,just prior to his anointment as CNO, young Kerry had created great problems for him and the other top brass,by killing so many non-combatant civilians and going after other non-military targets.‘We had virtually to straitjacket him to keep him under control,’ the admiral said. ‘Bud’ Zumwalt got it right when he assessed Kerry as having large ambitions — but promised that his career in Vietnam would haunt him if he were ever on the national stage.” And this statement was made despite the fact Zumwalt had personally pinned a Silver Star on Mr. Kerry.

Mr. Kerry was assigned to Swiftboat 44 on December 1, 1968. Within 24 hours, he had his first Purple Heart. Mr. Kerry accumulated three Purple Hearts in four months with not even a day of duty lost from wounds, according to his training officer. It’s a pity one cannot read his Purple Heart medical treatment reports which have been withheld from the public. The only person preventing their release is Mr. Kerry.

By his own admission during those four months, Mr. Kerry continually kept ramming his Swiftboat onto an enemy-held shore on assorted occasions alone and with a few men, killing civilians and even a wounded enemy soldier. One can begin to appreciate Zumwalt’s problem with Mr. Kerry as commander of an unarmored craft dependent upon speed of maneuver to keep it and its crew from being shot to pieces.
onward christian soldier!
span is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 29-02-04, 11:19 PM   #19
JackSpratts
 
JackSpratts's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: New England
Posts: 9,927
Default

"And this statement was made despite the fact Zumwalt had personally pinned a Silver Star on Mr. Kerry."

that says it all. how convienient the allegedly conflicted admiral is no longer with us. morally bankrupt and then some. keep dialing span.

- js.
JackSpratts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-03-04, 08:23 AM   #20
span
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,260
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by JackSpratts
"And this statement was made despite the fact Zumwalt had personally pinned a Silver Star on Mr. Kerry."

that says it all. how convienient the allegedly conflicted admiral is no longer with us. morally bankrupt and then some. keep dialing span.

- js.
hahaha so it's discounted because he's dead? wow, talk about grasping for excuses to bash someone, i'm suprised you didn't claim Bush had him killed to keep him quiet.
span is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump






All times are GMT -6. The time now is 06:01 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
© www.p2p-zone.com - Napsterites - 2000 - 2021