Cheney

[Mazer]

Originally Posted by theknife

perhaps the new Congress might want to look into the constitutional role of the VP's office - i know my high school civics teacher would appreciate the update.

That would be a nice distraction from America's real problems, wouldn't it?

Yeah, Cheney has a weird interpretation of his job, but he's got a point. The vice president has one Constitutional duty, to cast the tie-breaking vote in the senate and that makes him a figurehead at best. That's no excuse for his secrecy though. The Justice Department ought to get a court order to allow a search of Cheney's office. A figurehead like him only needs to keep the president's secrets, not his own.

Edit: not to discount the weight of this problem, but I think you're fishing for controversy, knife. Why the Federation of National Scientists has any opinion whatsoever on the vice president's classification practices, I can only guess, but I wouldn't be surprised if their inquiries were politically motivated. You needn't create a tempest in a teapot. There's enough real controversy in D.C. to go around.

[theknife]

Originally Posted by Mazer

That would be a nice distraction from America's real problems, wouldn't it?

Yeah, Cheney has a weird interpretation of his job, but he's got a point. The vice president has one Constitutional duty, to cast the tie-breaking vote in the senate and that makes him a figurehead at best. That's no excuse for his secrecy though. The Justice Department ought to get a court order to allow a search of Cheney's office. A figurehead like him only needs to keep the president's secrets, not his own.

Edit: not to discount the weight of this problem, but I think you're fishing for controversy, knife. Why the Federation of National Scientists has any opinion whatsoever on the vice president's classification practices, I can only guess, but I wouldn't be surprised if their inquiries were politically motivated. You needn't create a tempest in a teapot. There's enough real controversy in D.C. to go around.

the American Federation of Scientists is not the inquiring party - they only reported the inquiry on thier site. the investigating office is the Information Security Oversight Office. US News is reporting on it as well.

as far as relevance, Cheney's office has been instrumental in the creation of our current problems - the invasion of iraq in particular - but more generally in the overall erosion of the constitutional checks and balances vis a vis the assertion of executive power over the other branches of government. Cheney's the most powerful VP in history - and a champion of warrantless wiretapping, denial of habeas corpus, torture, secret courts, rendition, secret prisons, and of course, the disastrous invasion of Iraq and the manipulation of intelligence data therein. the above inquiry is symptomatic of the VP's fundamental abhorrence of transparency in government. democracy works best in the open, no?

[theknife]

The Libby trial is revealing fascinating details about Cheney's involvement in, well, just about everything:

"What didn't he touch? It's almost like there was almost nothing too trivial for the vice president to handle," said New York University professor Paul Light, an expert in the bureaucracy of the executive branch.

"The details suggest Cheney was almost a deputy president with a shadow operation. He had his own source of advice. He had his own source of access. He was making his own decisions,"

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070211/...cheney_s_world

[Mazer]

Originally Posted by theknife

the American Federation of Scientists is not the inquiring party - they only reported the inquiry on thier site. the investigating office is the Information Security Oversight Office. US News is reporting on it as well.

Mind if I nitpick? From your own link:

Last May, the Federation of American Scientists urged ISOO to press for the Vice President's compliance.

I'm still wondering why this would concern a group whose stated purpose is "to promote humanitarian uses of science and technology." Are they afraid that Cheney's statistics dodging is an abuse of technology that violates human rights? As conspiracy theories go, this one is weak tea.

Like I was trying to say, Cheney will probably be impeached over far worse charges than snubbing the FAS and the ISOO.

[theknife]

Originally Posted by Mazer

Mind if I nitpick? From your own link:

I'm still wondering why this would concern a group whose stated purpose is "to promote humanitarian uses of science and technology." Are they afraid that Cheney's statistics dodging is an abuse of technology that violates human rights? As conspiracy theories go, this one is weak tea.

Like I was trying to say, Cheney will probably be impeached over far worse charges than snubbing the FAS and the ISOO.

to pick some nit back , regardless of AFS motivation, the ISOO obviously thinks there's a case. from the US News article:

An important legal ruling is pending over Vice President Cheney's refusal to disclose statistics on document classification and declassification activity. The Information Security Oversight Office, which is responsible for the policy and oversight of the government's security classification system, has asked Attorney General Alberto Gonzales to direct Cheney's office to disclose these statistics.

Cheney's office provided the information until 2002 but then stopped doing so, J. William Leonard, the director of ISOO, told U.S. News. At issue is whether the office of the vice president is an executive branch entity when it comes to supporting the activities of the president and the vice president. The reporting requirements for disclosing classification and declassification activity fall under a presidential executive order.

"Basically the definition says that any entity of the executive branch that comes into possession of classified information is covered by the reporting requirements," says Leonard. "I have my understanding of what the executive order requires, and I'm going to the attorney general to ascertain if my reading of the executive order is correct."

the money quote: "But the office of the vice president is resisting even that minimal level of accountability."

[Mazer]

Well alright, enjoy this harmless little game of charades while it lasts. I'm not defending Cheney's secrecy, mind you, I'm just saying that there are more important issues on the public mind than this little 'scandal.'