Keep it up, George.....

[Ramona_A_Stone]

Originally Posted by Sinner

The Left Continues Its Celebration of the Murder of American Troops

Utter, slimey bullshit.

This kind of ludicrous fiction is for children who simply can't hold their own in a rational discussion. It's sickening to realize that anyone could be a big enough fucking fool to take it seriously.

No one is celebrating the death of troops. Yes, for those of us who were against the war for moral, strategic or purely rational reasons from the very beginning, the rising death toll is an indicator and underlines the point, but it is certainly no celebration.

At least we are aware of this toll and the implications, while apparently some of you are able to dismiss this toll utterly as merely a 'meaningless politically-loaded statistic,' and pretend that comparing it to bigger numbers and greater sacrifices renders it virtually insignificant.

Originally Posted by pisser

So tell me what good it has done, exactly, how are we any safer from terrorists, etc?

Isn't it interesting that no one will even approach this question when it's the exact reason we were given for going to war in the first place? Instead they think they can throw up a shield and make anyone against the war appear immoral with their ridiculous concoctions about our unpatriotic and antiamerican motivations.

When you motherfuckers can stop constructing a version of 'the left' that suits your intellectual laziness and deal with reality, there might be a reason to even discuss the war with you, but until then you're just making pointless noises that could just as easily issue from your assholes.

[Sinner]

Utter, slimey bullshit.

Of course it is Stone and it really only plays to the fringe element, which I would say pisser falls into - mainly because he seems fail to realize how your and his government works, with his it’s Bush’s Fault for everything bad that happens in the world. I do remember the Democrats voting to support this war, some are even trying to lead the party into the 08 election. The story I quoted is as ridicules as any of pisser’s posts.

What is the “left” or whatever’s solution to the war? From what I see Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi for example have not shown any interest in finding a way to win in Iraq, they are using hardball politics to try to set an absolute date for pulling out of Iraq. I do not believe surrender and retreat can be called a "solution". Now I do think many on the left and some on the right think it is a solution because they are losing patience and think mistakes are being made. Well I agree, mistakes have been made like mistakes were made in WWII for example. But You push on, you do not surrender.

The press will only report death counts - Can you answer any of these questions? Does the Press care? I think these are important questions and should be reported.

- How many battles are won day to day?
- How many insurgents are captured day to day?
- How many of the enemy are killed?
- How many of the enemy end up deserter?
- What have our troops done to save iraqi residents from being victims of war?
- How many children have Americans saved in Iraq?
- How much information and what kind of information are we receiving daily from the Iraq citizens?
- What schools are opening?
- Who got power today - are they happy?
- What businesses opened today?
- What medical services did our war doctors perform to save Iraqi citizens today?

[pisser]

Mazer, Albed and Sinner:

The frickin 3 stooges. I'll let you decide who is who, second thought, let albed decide, since he is the ass sucker authority.

Here is a message to you 3 spineless, blindly following conservative hacks:

WE CANNOT EVER 'WIN' , THERE IS NO DEFINITIVE WAY TO 'WIN'.

So get your head's out of Bushes ass, wipe the shit off, and then open your eyes and rejoin the real world!

[Sinner]

Edit --

[albed]

Wow, Mazer must have been a little rough with his new bitch; just look at him squeal.

[pisser]

Originally Posted by albed

Wow, Mazer must have been a little rough with his new bitch; just look at him squeal.

Since you don't have any decent comebacks, you just have to resort to idiotic responses.

You just know I'm right, and your dead wrong. Admit it, and ease your pain.

[Mazer]

Oh, you two go together like peanut butter and jelly.

I'm not after pisser in order to get under his skin. He has demonstrated a little free thinking lately, not much, but enough to engage me. I don't expect him to respond to my constructionist method any better than you have, albed, but if the worst name he calls me is 'stooge' then I must be doing something right. Anyway, I hope you enjoyed it while it lasted because now that Ramona has stooped to posting here I've lost interest in pisser.

Originally Posted by Ramona_A_Stone

At least we are aware of this toll and the implications, while apparently some of you are able to dismiss this toll utterly as merely a 'meaningless politically-loaded statistic,' and pretend that comparing it to bigger numbers and greater sacrifices renders it virtually insignificant.

You've either misread me or you're just being obtuse, for it is the media that have reduced our soldiers' sacrifice down to a mere statistic, not me. And I've pointed it out not to diminish the loss of life but to indict those who wave these statistics in the air like a banner. If you'll notice, I wasn't just comparing body counts but also time frames. The significance of those figures is subjective, but after four long years of war and occupation even I am surprised that so few have died, and glad too. You're too quick to accuse me of dismissing the numbers; I'm only callous compared to those like pisser who are blowing things way out of proportion, themselves guilty of dismissing historical statistics. The current death toll is only meaningless when it's quoted without context, and that's what I'm trying to establish. We've fought in far deadlier wars than this one and come out on top, so it's certainly possible to overcome the toll we've already incurred.

Though pisser's questions about what we've accomplished are valid, the lack of reporting by the media makes it impossible to answer those questions adequately. When they report all of the costs and none of the benefits it simply becomes impossible to perform a proper cost/benefit analysis. I like Sinner's list of questions better; they're more pertinent to our situation and, unlike pisser's questions, each has a verifiable answer. Those answers are necessary to establish context, too. Without knowing what we've gained it is simply impossible to judge the value of what we've lost. I'll tell you right now, I myself am not cognizant of the specific benefits of our war in Iraq, but there are people in this world, most of them journalists, who do know what's going on. I can only speculate as to why their knowledge has not been shared with the rest of us. I do know, however, that a dictator has been stripped of his power, his former subjects are now voting citizens, a constitution has been established in a once despotic nation, a parliament has taken power, and the free people of Iraq are now making the security of their country their responsibility, reliving us of that burden in the process. If that's not progress then I don't know what is.