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10-08-06, 11:19 AM | #21 | |
my name is Ranking Fullstop
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10-08-06, 01:03 PM | #22 |
Earthbound misfit
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Now knife, you're just pushing albed's buttons. What are you hoping to accomplish with this line of belligerant idiocy?
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10-08-06, 01:44 PM | #23 | |
my name is Ranking Fullstop
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10-08-06, 02:03 PM | #24 |
flippin 'em off
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Oh come on knife...we know perfectly well everything you say about Iraq here is completely false - advanced, industrialized, educated, and holding free elections - twice now.
So in this thread you're just adding belligerent idiocy to your ignorant bigotry. |
10-08-06, 02:09 PM | #25 | |
Thanks for being with arse
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Stay tuned as bunches of eager christians team up with gutter mouthed atheist republicans and boatloads of jews to scream 'arab lover' and 'anti-semite' any time anybody says anything against the current administration. |
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10-08-06, 05:44 PM | #26 | |
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Yippie i A
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shame on U.
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May your tote always stay tight and your edge eversharp :wink: |
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11-08-06, 02:01 PM | #27 | ||||
my name is Ranking Fullstop
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so why is a Connecticut Democratic primary in August so high on the White House radar screen? the White House is going well out of it's way to trash Lamont, with the VP even holding a highly unusual teleconference with reporters:
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11-08-06, 02:23 PM | #28 | ||||
flippin 'em off
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13-08-06, 11:35 AM | #29 | |
my name is Ranking Fullstop
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Lamont on Fox News Sunday...it's not hard to see why he connects with Connecticut voters:
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13-08-06, 02:36 PM | #30 | |
even the losers
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Survey of 500 Likely Voters August 9-10, 2006 Election 2006: Connecticut Senate Joseph Lieberman (I) 46% Ned Lamont (D) 41% Alan Schlesinger (R) 6% |
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13-08-06, 05:28 PM | #31 | |
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14-08-06, 08:20 AM | #32 |
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Three-term incumbent Sen. Joe Lieberman lost in the Democratic primary to as the media like to call him, the antiwar candidate Ned Lamont. Some would portray Lamont's victory as a sign that the Democratic Party has moved farther to the left. I would make the point that it is not the Democrats that have moved farther to the left but Lieberman that has moved farther to the right. Lieberman has always been in favor of school vouchers, a Republican plan to give public money to private schools. Like many of his former party he voted for the Iraq War but unlike many in his former party he agrees with President Bush to stay the present course even as current conditions in Iraq worsen. Those are issues that you can give some leeway to as far as bipartisanship goes. But and it is a big but, Joe Lieberman sided with the conservative Republicans on the Terri Schiavo legislation to prevent a doctor from doing what a doctor and the state felt was appropriate, letting a brain dead person die. That proves Lieberman has shifted to the right, whether he sees it or not, the Democratic Connecticut primary voters saw it and removed him. Bush publicly kissed Joe Lieberman on the cheek because he knew he could depend on Lieberman. Connecticut Democrats symbolically told Lieberman he could kiss a cheek a little lower down the body. Losing the Democratic primary didn't stop Lieberman he immediately started his campaign as an independent candidate. Not exactly what one would expect from the last vice presidential candidate, too have total disregard for the democratic process and run against the people's choice for his senate seat. Joe Lieberman is the new Zell Miller, a Republican pretending to be a Democrat. Joe Lieberman has gone from a man one could respect to an angry, bitter man trying to cling to power, it's pathetic really...
Republicans are trying to spin Lieberman's loss into a positive for themselves. White House Press Secretary Tony Snow said, "I know a lot of people have tried to make this a referendum on the president; I would flip it, I think instead it's a defining moment for the Democratic Party, whose national leaders now have made it clear that if you disagree with the extreme left in their party they're going to come after you." That is a very interesting comment. Consider the following and then reread Snow's comment... As it turns out Joe Lieberman wasn't the only incumbent to lose his primary. Republican Rep. Joe Schwarz also lost. Schwarz is a moderate; he lost to ultraconservative Tim Walberg, who was supported by the Michigan Right to Life and the conservative Club for Growth. There is one common element between Joe Lieberman and Joe Schwarz other than their first name, they both supported Bush's Iraq War, and Schwarz was even endorsed by Bush and Sen. John McCain. Tony Snow is vilifying the Democratic Party's national leaders for supporting the winner of the Democratic Party primary. Lieberman is now not just a disgruntled former Democrat but a stooge for the Republican Party. By running an independent campaign against the Democratic Party primary winner he is hurting the party that would have made him vice president in a selfish power grab that only helps the Republican Party. Joe Lieberman will be now known as a sore loser and a disgraceful politician... As mentioned, Tony Snow said, "I know a lot of people have tried to make this a referendum on the president; I would flip it, I think instead it's a defining moment for the Democratic Party, whose national leaders now have made it clear that if you disagree with the extreme left in their party they're going to come after you." Lets flip it again. The president endorsed Joe Schwarz and Joe Schwarz lost. Schwarz supported abortion rights and embryonic stem cell research. It may be a defining moment for the Republican Party because it is clear that if you disagree with the extreme right in their party they're going to come after you. Of course I am using Tony Snow's words to show that one could spin Schwarz' loss just as easy as Snow spins Lieberman' loss for his party. One thing that is clear is that both Joes, Lieberman and Schwarz were linked to Bush and both lost. Maybe the extremes in both parties are taking over or it is a referendum on the president, the public being tired of a failed Bush Administration and want change. Either way, change is coming and change is good... |
14-08-06, 02:01 PM | #33 | |
flippin 'em off
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14-08-06, 05:53 PM | #34 | |
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14-08-06, 06:42 PM | #35 | |
my name is Ranking Fullstop
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normally, primary campaigns tend to sound extreme because they are designed to appeal to single-issue voters and party die-hards - usually the only ones who turn out to vote in primaries. but the Connecticut Democratic primary had an record-breaking 46% turn-out...unheard-of for an August primary. these numbers suggest that it may be the center, not the fringe, who are driving the electorate. |
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14-08-06, 09:53 PM | #36 |
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If that's the case, knife, then I hope to see more of it. I was about to say that the reason that extremists seem to be increasing in numbers is because voter turnout is low, and the only people who bother are the ones with extreme views. The silent majority are apathetic, especially during primaries, and the result is sharp division among our leaders in Washington. However, I can't concieve how Connecticut's nominaiton of Lamont could possibly be considered moderation on the part of Democrats there. They nominated a man who is more liberal than Leiberman, not less, and what happened there was preciesly the opposite of what happened in Georgia.
Populism and moderation are not necessarily the same thing. The promotion of stem cell research and the banning of ID curriculua in public schools are examples of popular opinions, but you ought to understand that many people still consider those policies to be extreme measures. (I myself think science should be left to the scientists and politicians shouldn't be allowed to interfere. If people want to teach ID in their own school districts, let them. If the corpses of unborn babies have already been harvested for stem cells, let scientists use them.) Don't pretend to be a moderate just because in the past year a majority of Americans have begun to agree with your opposition to the war. The war isn't the only issue people care about, and you're still far left of the majority of Americans on most issues. |
15-08-06, 04:51 AM | #37 | |||
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15-08-06, 08:33 AM | #38 |
Earthbound misfit
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You're asking me to tell you what you believe so you can tell me that I have no clue what your personal beliefs really are. knife, you don't need to trap me to persuade me that I may be wrong. But what I can tell about you, without naming specific political issues, is that you honestly believe that the slim majority of voters who chose Bush the last time around are either stupid or evil. And now that some of those voters have gradually begun to question their choices, you wish in your heart of hearts that the presidential election were being held now rather than two years ago. I'm telling you that sharing the popular opinion is not what makes one a moderate; the fact that the majority of Americans are curently moderate is only coincidence. Give us a couple more decades of the one-issue politics we're witnessing now and extremists on both sides will become the majority. It is your predictability that betrays your left-wing beliefs, knife. On every issue that comes up in this forum we all know before ever reading your posts what position you're going to take because you always take the progressive or the Democratic position. Take that as a compliment if you like, be proud that you're not a moderate. But don't try to tell me that when the majority of Americans move left of center that it means Democrats are becoming moderate. It only means that more Americans are becoming more extreme in their political views, and that doesn't bode well for this country.
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15-08-06, 06:00 PM | #39 | |
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15-08-06, 08:54 PM | #40 |
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So you're saying that because Republicans are making Democrats look like moderates by comparison that means the Democrats are actually becoming moderates? I can believe that the fence riders are starting to lean left, but that doesn't mean that the Dems will lean right to meet them in the middle. The core constituency of both parties are perfectly matched, so in this election year the Dems will make populist campaign promises to win the moderates. But after they increase their seats in Congress, possibly taking contol, you won't see them pandering to the middle anymore.
I look at both parties and I see politicians among both of them doing what they do best, acting selfish and playing games. You look at both parties and you think one of them is better or less evil than the other. It isn't; they're both equally bad and the current system sucks. That's my ideology. The reason I can't make a distiction between Democrats and Republicans is becasue there is no distincion. In the end I vote Republican, not because I have any delusions that they actually care what I think, but because the occasional tax cut is part of their political strategy, and it's the only benefit I recieve from the games they play on Capitol Hill. |
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