Iran: A Bridge too Far?

[Drakonix]

Show me a link to an official U.S. military source site that claims that the picture shown above is an Iranian made mortar shell.

The Iranian made "Explosive Formed Penetrator" or EFP devices they have been talking about are not mortar shells and do not look like that.

They can not be correctly classified as an IED (Improvised Explosive Device) because they are not improvised devices. They are being mass-manufactured in Iran for a specific purpose - to kill and maim Iraqi and coalition soldiers.

The picture above is simply anti-Bush, anti-war propaganda.

See picture below for the Iranian made EFP device.

[multi]

One ambassador in Washington said he was taken aback when John Hannah, Vice President Cheney’s national security adviser, said during a recent meeting that the administration considers 2007 “the year of Iran” and indicated that a U.S. attack was a real possibility.

http://thinkprogress.org/2007/02/12/hannah-iran/

[RDixon]

Originally Posted by Drakonix

Show me a link to an official U.S. military source site that claims that the picture shown above is an Iranian made mortar shell.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...021100479.html

[Drakonix]

Try again, if you wish.

The WP article you linked to does not show the picture of an 81mm mortar round and claim it was of Iranian origin.

The article is NOT from an official U.S. military source.

The WP article specifically mentions a special bomb type coming from Iran and specifically mentions "explosively formed penetrator" or EFP:

During a long-awaited presentation, held in Baghdad's fortified Green Zone, the officials displayed mortar shells, rocket-propelled grenades and a powerful cylindrical bomb, capable of blasting through an armored Humvee, that they said were manufactured in Iran and supplied to Shiite militias in Iraq for attacks on U.S. and Iraqi troops.

U.S. military officials in Iraq had previously described the use of "explosively shaped charges" to target vehicles, but Sunday's briefing was the first time they displayed pieces of what they called an "explosively formed penetrator" or EFP.

The EFP devices are "explosively shaped charges" that expel a high velocity armor defeating metallic projectile in a specific direction.

The EFP devices are large and quite powerful. For example, a standard CD or DVD is 120mm in diameter. So, the 81 mm mortar shell is approximately 32% smaller in diameter than a CD. The EFP devices are about 12 inches (approximately 305mm) in diameter, or over two and half times larger than a CD, and about 376% the size of the 81mm mortar shell. Whereas the mortar shell explodes in a circular pattern, the EFP device directs the force of the blast in a narrow aimed direction.

The article says photographs were not allowed during the presentation:

The officials released a PowerPoint presentation including photographs of the weaponry, but did not allow media representatives to record, photograph or videotape the briefing or the materials on display.

The "precision machining" characteristic of Iranian origin is of the EFP devices, NOT ordinary mortar or rocket propelled grenade munitions. Specifically, the precision machining is of the metallic disk that becomes the projectile when the device detonates. It's shape is special and causes the force of the explosion to be concentrated in a specific direction.

The 81mm mortar round depicted with a claim that the U.S. military stated it is of Iranian origin is apparently a hoax perpetrated by an anti-Bush, anti-war, anti-U.S. source.

The article you linked to confirms the facts that I have posted regarding the Iranian made EFP devices.

[RDixon]

Let the back-peddling begin.
Now we see why none of the "military officials" in Baghdad that presented the slideshow that DID include the picture of the mortor round were so keen on not being identified.

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/...8N8SBQO1.shtml

[Drakonix]

The slideshow did include pictures of mortar rounds and rocket propelled grenades, as the WP article states. It is true that such munitions have been used to construct IED roadside bombs.

From the descriptions of the presentation, the slideshow did not present a 81mm mortar round as Iranian made. The Iranian made devices in question are not mortar rounds or rocket propelled grenades, they are EFP devices.

IMO the statement

That does not translate that the Iranian government per se, for sure, is directly involved in doing this," Pace said. "What it does say is that things made in Iran are being used in Iraq to kill coalition soldiers.

does indeed qualify as "back-peddling" when contrasted to much stronger statements recently made. The inference in previous statements is clearly that the Iranian Government is directly involved. However, it is important to note that General Pace has a minority opinion about the involvement of the Iranian Government in the matter.

The 81mm mortar round picture and caption claiming that the mortar round munition is certified by the U.S. military as Iranian is simply a purposeful lie by anti-Bush/anti-war/anti-U.S. source(s).

Again, it is the EFP devices that are Iranian made, or minimally contain Iranian made parts.

[RDixon]

"In a news briefing held under strict security, the officials spread out on two small tables an E.F.P. and an array of mortar shells and rocket-propelled grenades with visible serial numbers that the officials said link the weapons directly to Iranian arms factories. The officials also asserted, without providing direct evidence, that Iranian leaders had authorized smuggling those weapons into Iraq for use against the Americans. The officials said such an assertion was an inference based on general intelligence assessments."

All under strict anonymity too because they knew it was all crap and did not want their names connected with it.
The purpose was to plant the seeds, by way of the willing press, that Iran is killing americans in Iraq in the kool-aid drinker's feeble minds and they greedily suck it up and beg for more.

Now say you're sorry for doubting me

[Sinner]

Iraqi insurgents using Austrian rifles from Iran

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main...3/wiran313.xml

Google will supply more news sources if you search.


--More than 100 of the.50 calibre weapons, capable of penetrating body armour, have been discovered by American troops during raids.

Within 45 days of the first HS50 Steyr Mannlicher rifles arriving in Iran, an American officer in an armoured vehicle was shot dead by an Iraqi insurgent using the weapon.

They said 170 American and British soldiers had been killed by such weapons.

[Mazer]

Originally Posted by RDixon

All under strict anonymity too because they knew it was all crap and did not want their names connected with it.

They would have identified themselves if the press conference had been held in the safety of Washington, D.C. instead of Baghdad. It isn't your withering ridicule they're afraid of. The insurgents read the news and if these men had identified themselves they would now have bounties on their heads.

Anyway, the press loves reporting information garnered from anonymous insiders. What's the big deal?