Decision 2004: You Make The Call
 

so who's gonna win the election?

70 some-odd days away... let's see which of you armchair generals is the savviest pundit. call it now and we'll see come November 2.

i think Bush is gonna squeak through - don't think Kerry got what it takes to convince the majority of the electorate. i hope i'm wrong (and in fact, i usually am about these things) but that's the way it looks from here.

i hope you are wrong too..
but somehow i dont think the conservatives are going to
risk upsetting their agenda here or in the US, that they have probably had in the works for the last 15 or so years...i dont think they have achieved their desired level of fear and disarray in what they percieve as the lowerclasses...

they will likely swindle their way through another election create a much more
of a mess of our political system..install more of the corporate rich to positions of power then allow themselves to lose ...to an opposition that will find it near to impossible to rectify any of the conditions created by these corupt sorry excuses for human beings..

Swindle
 

Did I read the word swindle....?

U think Kerry aint a thief?

hahahahahaah

Purple hearts for sale here..... oops i got a pimple, time for another ribbon


The dude scamed the gov in order to get out of the war.

It worked for him.

I think Bush will win, this time with an unambiguous majority. However, the Dems will win majorities in both the house and senate, but the majority will be so slim that nothing will be accomplished. A do-nothing congress is a double edged sword: fairly benign in the fact that few new laws will be passed (which is good since we already have too many and new laws cannot grant new rights, they can only take them away), but in three years congress will face a budget crisis when they can't agree on which programs to cut and which taxes to hike, and of course Bush will take the blame for it. Go figure. :uu:
I know you explained it to me before, but I'm still amused that citizens of other countries take our presidential elections so seriously. It isn't your political system, unless you're willing to live here and become an American.

Well... I guess it has something to do with the fact that American democracy is the 'model' for so many other democracies around the world, isnt it? You see, the world bends at your knee, awaiting the glorious outcome of your infallible election, desperate to integrate your democratic abilities into our own feeble, somewhat-lesser systems. That is why we take your elections so seriously. It also depends on where you live:

If you live in the UK or Australia, you'd like to know which country you'll be bombing next. I guess if you live in the middle-east, you'd be wondering whether to bother rebuilding your house. If you're living on planet earth, you'd probably take a passing interest at which talking-head you'll have to look at when being patronised.

Not only that, but if Bush is kicked out, I'm gonna have to change the head on my voodoo doll. :ick:

sure i take an interest... we also have federal elections coming up here..
and i was refering to what they had done to the democratic political system here in order to support the US and its terror war and make aus terror targets too..conservative governments generaly like to destroy the publicly owned assets in society and kill off small business and only ever support big companies with often unseen changes that cant be undone by succedeing governments..

I will be voting for Kerry, and i believe that he will win by a considerable amount.

I think that the american people as a whole are sick and tired of hearing about terror warning this and terror alert that and more dead US military in Iraq....i grew tired of it long ago.

Usless side fact...

From the first election of my life (born in December 1980, so that would be G. H. W. Bush in '88) I have picked the winner, yea its only been 4 times, but still 4 and 0 isnt bad. Im going with my gut here....we will see if i end up 5 and 0 or 4 and 1 ;)

Im sure you liked Regan in 84 but you probably dont remember. :D
My voting record started 1988 (18) and I am 2-2. Good luck gutr I hope you are right again.


My prediction: John Edwards will be President.

that's an interesting call....you mean Kerry will be unable to go the distance, for whatever reason, so Edwards will step in and win?

this guy has president writen all over him..

maybe in another decade or so
:AP:

Somebody has too
 

Somebody has too.

I would love to come and live in the states.
Tell me how.
Legally.
Did you know the U.K.is one of the only country's that it's citizens
Can't get permits in the 50,000 that are given out every year in
a lottery.
Yes I could come illegally.
(I was offered a job last year)
But I would like to do it properly.
Your labour laws are somewhat restricting I was told.
Local people first and all that.

i was really refering to what consevative governments do to democratic countries generaly..if you follow the notion that the US ,UK and australia are a coalition of democratic countries caught up in some modern day crusades recruiting the next generation of terrorists by installing a rabid hate for western democracies
..its a psyops operation being waged against us by our leaders..basicly a smokescreen while they prop up more big business,diminsh your rights and let israel run rampant..
its too late to stop these fuckers they overtook any real opposition long ago..
but all in all ..what ever happens..eventualy some light will be shed on our seemingly domed future at the hands of madmen..and the light will be love..



Hymn 419
Lord of all being, throned afar,
thy glory flames from sun and star;
center and soul of every sphere,
yet to each loving heart how near!
Sun of our life, thy quickening ray
sheds on our path the glow of day;
star of our hope, thy softened light
cheers the long watches of the night.
Our midnight is thy smile withdrawn,
our noontide is thy gracious dawn,
our rainbow arch thy mercy's sign;
all, save the clouds of sin, are thine.
Lord of all life, below, above,
whose light is truth, whose warmth is love,
before thy ever-blazing throne
we ask no luster of our own.
Grant us thy truth to make us free,
and kindling hearts that burn for thee,
till all thy living altars claim
one holy light, one heavenly flame.
Words: Oliver Wendell Holmes, 1848


i prefer to watch fireworks from a distance..:W:

Yes.

maybe someone here knows but i'm not sure it works that way before the election. if kerry or bush dropped out or droped dead prior to election day, their vp's could still be elected - as vp's - but i think the prez would have to be chosen by congress (and i guess congress would choose a vp if it wanted). obviously after a presidential candidate's sworn in a vp assumes the office if said prez kicks the bucket, i just don't know if he does automatically before the guy's even elected.

- js.

The 20th Amendment allows leaders of the party of the popular-vote winner to select a new presidential candidate if the winner dies before the Electoral College meets. The college would then vote on that selection. If the popular-vote winner dies after the college meets but before the inauguration, the winning candidate for vice president becomes president. Neither of these provisions has ever been applied.

http://www2.worldbook.com/features/p...html/roads.htm

Not exactly what you asked, but it implies a special convention to me

if a candidate dies before the election, i would think all it takes is for the party in question to say "this is our new nominee". if they have time to move his name up to the top slot in the ballot, and if a majority of people pull the lever, that oughta be it, no?

soFloyd's scenario is something like Kerry drops out for some scandalous reason (or gets sick or dies, but a scandal seems more within the realm of possibility), Edwards becomes the de facto nominee and goes on to beat Bush. i like it :ND:

p.s. i mighta known this thread would end up in left field - shoulda just made it a poll :hmm:

another goverment worker out to raise taxes.


Hahahahahahaha, fur sure

well yeah, but it could take weeks to get that name on ballots. if he died close to election day they could forget about it.

- js.

whos on first though? :D

at least I made a prediction. :)

unlike others :frank:

i'll change my earlier assessment - i think Kerry is going to pull it out. i didn't think so when i started this thread in August but he's only gotten stronger while the Prez has not moved an inch.

electoral vote count:

Kerry 302
Bush 236

Press cynical on US poll
 

As Tuesday's US presidential election approaches, many papers across the world wonder if the outcome will make any real difference.

Some reflect worries about the robustness of the voting system, while others are less shy in expressing a political preference. There is a distinct sense the world may be due for a change at the top.

The question of who will be the next US president and which one of the two parties in the US will be the winner of the election is not important at all... The Democrats and the Republicans are all tarred with the same brush.

Iran's Jomhuri-Ye Eslami

A Bush victory may lead to more of the same movement towards unilateral exercise of US power. But would a Kerry presidency be any different?

Malaysia's The Star

At the end of the day, the US president, whether Democrat or Republican, will be elected primarily on their agenda for the US. And in US politics, Africa is barely a tiny blip on the radar.

Kenya's Nation

No drastic change in policy is expected, but the result will signal whether the aggressive, unilateralist role America has adopted in the past four years is going to continue or be scaled down. The difference in the end may be reflected only in nuances.

Pakistan's Dawn

Regardless of who claims victory in these elections, the al-Qaeda leader will emerge the biggest winner.

London-based Arabic paper Al-Quds al-Arabi

The Iraqi street is still wondering whether America's position in Iraq will change if Kerry wins, whether America will stay the course in Iraq or run for its life.

Iraq's Al-Shira

No matter who wins in Tuesday's presidential vote, the outcome seems destined for rejection by almost half the country.

Canada's The Toronto Star

This election is a test for the American people on how far they are willing to show empathy with people of other nations and how far they want to expand their horizons.

Indonesia's Pikiran Rakyat

The USA is celebrating its great festival of democracy enveloped in all kinds of suspicions, doubts and mistrust about the fairness of the process and the guarantees of the final count.

Spain's El Razon

The best thing for both candidates and for the prestige of US democracy itself is for there not to a repetition of the foul-ups of 2000.

Spain's El Pais

On Tuesday the US will be under the spotlight, the rest of the world expects to see the self-proclaimed champion of democracy leading by example.

Zimbabwe's Sunday Mirror

The surfacing of al-Qaeda leader, Osama Bin Laden, in a video tape has made the US voter doubt whether the Bush administration has really achieved anything in the last four years.

Saudi Arabia's Al-Watan

To get rid of an atmosphere where violence is seen as the only solution, the last hope is the victory of Kerry.

Turkey's Sabah

Only one candidate came to public office as a warrior scarred and cautioned by war. The other came to office as a moral tourist.

Australia's Sydney Morning Herald

For the sake of world progress John Kerry's victory would be preferable so that Europe and the USA may have a chance to start afresh together.

France's Le Monde

The Bush revolution, like many of its kind, has exhausted itself. America now needs a president who does not turn his back on the need to eradicate and eliminate Islamic terrorism, but seeks to do this efficiently, wisely and with international support.

Israel's Yediot Aharonot

If Kerry wins the elections, it can be expected that a very different atmosphere may be formed both in America and the world.

Turkey's Milliyet

The importance of these elections is unquestionable, because at stake is living for four more years with the unilateralism that has imbued the policies of the Bush administration or being able to take the path of international co-operation.

Spain's El Mundo


BBc

oh well :N: as usual, i failed to recognize that i just don't see things like most people. often that's a blessing - at election time, it's a curse.

i feel like the circus just left town.

Don't feel bad, my predection was wrong too: the Reps still control Congress, and by a larger margin than they did before. I was way off.

Well, i was wrong...i thought kerry could rally the people, but when the votes started coming in, it was obvious he spent too much time fighting for very few votes in the 'battleground' states of the east.

Maybe its time for a mass liberal exodus. I'm sure there are a couple of countries that will have the liberal losers and all the whining that goes with them.

I don't know you but based on your response here, I'd have to guess that you're one of the few that is rich enough to have received one of GWB's tax breaks.

That's the only thing he did during his 1st term, give the "have's" more.

That's the problem with liberals, their reality is completely warped. When the government isn't taking from people to the liberals it is giving, as if everything belonged to the government to dole out to the people. I still pay taxes but since I don't pay as much somehow the government is giving me money. And when the government reduces welfare it is taking from the poor, as if they had something to take.

Liberals live in their own world of bullshit and until they learn to deal honestly with reality they'll always be the whining losers in the end.

I do my best to honestly deal with the bullshit I have to live with. It's all I have. Unlike our current administration, I can't spend it until I have it. That my friend, is reality.
http://www.thirdworldtraveler.com/Bu...g_Squeeze.html

If you don't understand borrowing you're living in a world of incredible ignorance as well as bullshit.

How do you people survive?

Maybe we should all get a clue from our happy and well-adjusted poster-boy of conservatism in the post above, who sounds like he's about to have a fucking stroke as he whines and whines about crack selling convicts and fat welfare mothers who are somehow getting more of his money, which is more deserved, than ours.

Does it ever occur to you insular freaks that there are plenty of liberals who actually have jobs and also have worked hard all their lives to get what they have and are also cognizant of what comes out of their earnings and where it goes and still manage to be HUMAN, or is it just safer in your little imagined worlds to simply believe that we're all living in carefree luxury while we plot how to take working people's money and arbitrarily give it away to lazy parasites and junkies?

It's the funniest thing I've ever seen to be lectured about what constitutes 'reality' by solipsistic assholes so willfully out of touch with it.

P.S. To Jughead, or whatever your name is. If you really want to remain the mysterious working class hero we know nothing about, you'd fare better to not to wave your delusional martyr complexes around.

Oh yeah, and...

Could you please lecture us on the subjects of ignorance and maturity again... Please?

Ramona, jcmd, people don't give money to the poor or take money from the rich out of pity, they do so out of guilt. The economic difference between liberals and conservatives is that the left feels guilty for achieving success and the right feels proud for achieving success; neither is virtuous. People should not be demanded by other people to give charity to those in need. And people should be perfectly willing to give some of what they have in order to support those in need. In essence, the decision for the rich to support the poor should always be the individual, personal decision of the person giving, and yet giving is still compulsory. Somewhere between guilt and pride lies compassion.

And keep in mind that even though being a welfare reciepient isn't something for a person to be proud of, they shouldn't feel guilty either. The system is there to put people back on track, and it usually works like it's supposed to. Though it isn't always possible for the welfare system to operate on the principle of compassion, the government should behave as if it did. There are many who abuse the system, but maybe they'd be more motivated to get off welfare if those government checks weren't treated like a God-given right by liberals and a waste of funds by conservatives. Maybe if rich people gave willingly then poor people would recieve graciously. In truth, 'redistribution of wealth' is a misnomer, welfare was never intended to promote socialism. Unfortunatly it has that potential and because of that some people think it should be socialized and others think it should be done away with all together, both groups are dead wrong.

The government does give and it does take, and often it does too much of both. But when we realize that it is as Lincoln said 'a government of the people, by the people, and for the people' then we begin to understand that some of its functions are redundant and can be handled without a supreme authority dictating our conscience. Charity is a prime example of that fact, because welfare is nothing more than our collective will codified into law. The next step becomes obvious, it isn't the welfare system that needs reform but the welfare proponents and beneficiaries who need to change the way they see the situation. The law will eventually change, it always does, and it will accuratly reflect our preconcieved notions. As long as we recognise charity as the legimate child of compassion then those laws will be burdons easily borne and rarely abused.

so, in other words, the majority weren't voting for Bush - they were actually voting against Kerry? well, then it all makes sense - thanks for clearing that up. :tu:

What's with all this fishing for reasons for Kerry's loss. Didn't you say you'd hold your nose and vote for the slimeball? One of you liberals did and most indicated they hated Bush more than they liked Kerry. Just face it; the guy's disgusting even to liberals so why are you looking for reasons he lost?

Oh Ramona, could you please complain to us again about the three jobs you're holding...Please.

HAHAHHAHHAHAHHAAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!

Where were all those hard working, managing to be HUMAN liberals on VOTING DAY Sean?

VOTING FOR BUSH thats where they were! While the rest of your liberal friends all living in carefree luxury threw their votes away on another liberal living in carefree luxury who was planning on spending the next 4 years plotting how to take working people's money and arbitrarily give it away to lazy parasites and junkies?

For someone who uses a thesaurus so well you don't have a grasp of what your reading or saying. Your post was nothing but sour grapes from a loser that votes for losers and lives in his own internet fantasy world where he can make believe he's important and needed unlike in the REALITY of his own sad pathetic existance in humanity.

You lecture me on how to fair better in this world, and you think I'm delusional. :rofl:

"Mission accomplished, you're an asshole"

ROTFLMAO

:BL:

Good one :tu: