P2P-Zone - reality check

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- Political Asylum (http://www.p2p-zone.com/underground/forumdisplay.php?f=34)

- - reality check (http://www.p2p-zone.com/underground/showthread.php?t=21870)

the Prez in radio la-la land yesterday, desperately trying to keep the dream alive:

Quote:

“So we will honor the fallen by completing the mission for which they gave their lives, and by doing so we will ensure that freedom and peace prevail.
..And when that mission of defeating the terrorists in Iraq is complete, our troops will come home to a proud and grateful nation.”

it's almost like his weekly bedtme story for the nation - the only thing missing is "...and then they lived happily ever after."

but, almost amazingly simultaneously, members of his administration can no longer sustain the fantasy. from today's Washington Post:

Quote:

The United States no longer expects to see a model new democracy, a self-supporting oil industry or a society in which the majority of people are free from serious security or economic challenges, U.S. officials say.

the administration is just now figuring out what some of us have been saying for three years. doh. so how come this information can't come from the Prez? maybe a little too much of a downer for his weekly bedtime stories?

Quote:

"What we expected to achieve was never realistic given the timetable or what unfolded on the ground," said a senior official involved in policy since the 2003 invasion. "We are in a process of absorbing the factors of the situation we're in and shedding the unreality that dominated at the beginning."

translation: what the fuck were we thinking? take note that all of this stuff has to come from anonymous administration officials - because no top Bush official will go on record and admit the truth: " by the way, we fucked up and nothing is going to work out like we thought it would."

Quote:

"We've said we won't leave a day before it's necessary. But necessary is the key word -- necessary for them or for us? When we finally depart, it will probably be for us," a U.S. official said.

yup, the Prez always leaves out that part. "necessary" at this point means pulling out at whatever time is necessary to make sure that GOP congressmen running for Congress in 2006 don't have spend election season scrubbing the stain of Iraq from thier campaigns. in other words, the timetable is driven by US elections, not Iraq elections.

Quote:

"We set out to establish a democracy, but we're slowly realizing we will have some form of Islamic republic," said another U.S. official familiar with policymaking from the beginning, who like some others interviewed would speak candidly only on the condition of anonymity. "That process is being repeated all over."

so now that we're conceding Jeffersonian democracy is a pipe dream, Bush is apparently now asking Mr. & Mrs. America to sacrifice thier kids to prop up an Islamic republic in Iraq. hmm - - could be a tough sell for the military recruiters, no?

Yep, Jeffersonian democracy was instantly perfect in the US, giving blacks and women voting rights and never needing any changes to this very date. Shame if Iraq can't be like that huh?

I hope they avoid civil war like the US did because it was so perfect from day one.

Oh, if only the administration had listened to the wise liberal cowards and huddled into a fetal position after 9/11 and gushed apologies, then they wouldn't be facing any difficulties or setbacks.

But the liberal politicians themselves were singing a different tune back then, so aren't they as much to blame? No, let's forget about that, just like so many other things that need forgetting or modifying. The liberals were right all along.

According to them.

let's replace a fascist dictatorship with a theocratic dictatorship. let's replace the rule of whim with the rule of whim (the mayor of baghdad was deposed in a coup last week). let's replace middle of the night arrests and vanishings with middle of the night arrests and disappearances and in so doing insure that a few thousand americans and a few 10's of thousands of iraqi civilians die gruesome deaths in the process. christ what a fucking outrage - conservative america's banally evil architects of war. everyone of these bastards should be impeached, arrested and hung, in no particular order - to the fullest extent of the law of course. start with bush. strip him of his office and use his family’s wealth to pay reparations to american and iraqi casualties, then move on down the list until every last man and woman responsible for this wholly avoidable indignation has begun a personal sacrifice commensurate with the suffering they caused.

- js.

Yes, let your hatred guide you and make you strong middle aged padawan.

Think of Kennedy and Vietnam or the Bay of Pigs and your journey to the dark side will be complete.

Or is that entirely different from your perspective?

.

conservative commentator Armstrong Williams, an otherwise strong supporter of the Prez, finally gets it: it's time to bail out of Iraq.

Quote:

Every day insurgents strap bombs to their bodies and detonate themselves in public squares. Get it? The insurgents are not trying to defeat us. They are willing to die, just to take some of us with them. We cannot win this kind of war of attrition. US soldiers are dying at a rate of one per day. Meanwhile the rest of the world is having trouble supporting the United States. You cannot lead in a global democracy, if people do not trust you. It is undeniable that we went about this in a very flawed manner. We need to admit that. We cannot solve the problem of terrorism by asserting our will on the world. Meanwhile, the deterioration of Iraq continues, serving as a sad reminder of the failed promise of this mission, and the need to pull out.

amen to that.

Interesting article by this Armstrong Williams fellow.
If he's a "conservative commentator" as you say?
It seems he thinks Bush had the right idea but is now wrong.
Now some people say he had the wrong idea from the start
I think he doesn't seem to think at all.
Getting out is going to be a big problem.
The British I think on the whole don't like the war in Iraq,
but except we have to stay for now.
It's all been a bit of a cock up really.
The daft thing is,if they keep bombing us in Britain.
We will just dig our heels in.
If they bomb America,they'll all want out.
Basic difference in character?
Not sure.
It's a big problem all right.