Cindy Sheehan
 

the Prez is back on a five week vacation at the ranch in Crawford Texas for his 50th vacation of his presidency, making him the most leisurely, well-rested president in history. while he attracts many protesters along his travels, he's got one outside the gates of the ranch that just won't go away:
Mrs. Sheehan is an angry and distraught mother but she's got some legitimate and relatively straightforward questions for the President and she says not leaving until she speaks to him. the Bushies, sensing the unfolding PR disaster, trot out some fairly high-level aides to talk to her:
i'll bet they don't believe that either. but apparently the Prez and Mrs. Sheehan have had at least one choice exchange on a previous occasion:
ouch. no wonder Bush is ducking her.

but he may not be able to do so for long, as her story snowballs. and as it does, watch the GOP smear machine begin to target her, questioning her patriotism, her motherhood, her son's service etc. right out of the Rove playbook. but you might think that our bring-em-on, smoke-em-out, tough-talking commander-In-Chief could handle a one-on-one with a 48 year-old California housewife and answer a very basic question:

throw her in a jail until the pres finishes his vacation...

"Why did you kill my son?" is a loaded, politically charged question to begin with, which is why the president doesn't want to answer it. And by all accounts, the president isn't a suspect in her son's death, he wasn't in Iraq at the time it occured and the perpetrator was most likely an arab. We all know she just wants to talk to the president so she can argue with him in front of a bunch of reporters, so can you blame him for sending out his aides with whom she has no personal grudge?

Link

The media is going to take this woman's grief and turn it into a crusade against the president, which will do nothing but prolong Ms. Sheehan's mourning period. The media's obsession with turning tragedy into entertainment sickens me to no end.

I think you've got that backwards somewhat Mazer. She's using the media for her own purpose just like Terri Schiavo's parents did recently. Without media attention and support she'd be just another lying loonie whose slander would get her sued if it was directed against a private citizen. You can bet she's contacted them with information as to when and where she'll be performing.

Of course the media is quite happy hyping her performance into a national sideshow.

hmmm. so you know what bush is thinking.

the entire affair of war is loaded and politically charged and bush has spared no effort putting his loaded and politically charged points across at every opportunity. either in person or by proxy, with the full acquiescence of the media. how did americans gather basic information, or misinformation about iraq? how was it that you heard about wmds and 45 minute nuclear windows? about uranium purchases and missions accomplished? unless bush came to your home and told you personally - and he didn’t tell me - you heard his spin from the press. he told them and they passed it along, relatively verbatim with little in the way of modifiers. “here’s what the president said today.” it’s part of their job. did that sicken you too, or are you sickened only when distraught moms get attention grieving unbearable losses that this president – who ordered this war - will never experience, let alone comprehend? if so such rigid one-sidedness borders on the pathological.

- js.

Cindy Sheehan in 2004
Cindy Sheehan in 2005
someone needs to ask Cindy to explain her different takes on the meeting with Bush, or would that be "smearing" her?

You left out the best part dd.


It won't be the liberal mass media.

I cant begin to imagine losing a son, much less having one. I suppose shes a bit crazy because of it. Cut her some slack, shes probably an emotional wreck.

Poor women,grief is awful thing.
I don't know about using the press.
The press love this sort of thing anyway.
Her lad was a volunteer wasn't he.
You don't join up without knowing the risk.

Why doesn't George have her in for tea and Sympathy
They could have pretzels and he can explain how he nearly died once.
That could evoke the mother in Cindy and everything would be fine again.

Most of their job is turning "Here's what the president said today" into a form of entertainment. Being informative is one of their primary concerns, I'm certain, but each news agency faces stiff competetion. They over hype most everything to keep their audience watching, and unfortunatly that leaves enough air time for only half the story. Everything is fair game, from the nameless dead in the war to the personal tragedy of a mother. I think I've mentioned before that I don't watch cable news channels anymore, and lately I've stopped watching the local news as well. The news has lost all credibility with me. Whereas once the free press was responsible for holding public figures accountable, now all they do is try to make them look as bad as possible in every circumstance. This poor lady is their weapon against the president, whether she likes it or not, and they won't release her until they've trashed the his reputation. And like any gun, she'll walk away from this experience empty, feeling dirty and used.

it's not that complicated, fellas...and it doesn't even need to be that political.

the Prez could take all the wind out of this story today by stopping by her little encampment outside the ranch on his way to wherever, simply sitting down with this woman privately, and letting her vent for 10 minutes. end of story.

but i don't think he has the heart...this is the same president who is never ever allowed to be in any kind of unscripted situation, with members of the public, where all the questions and answers aren't carefully orchestrated. this president is only capable of discussing his actions in front of carefully screened audiences, each of whom has signed a loyalty oath, who are guaranteed not to ask any uncomfortable questions. citizens with the wrong t-shirts or or bumper stickers are dragged away from his events by force, even arrested.

this president loathes accountability, neither he or his handlers will ever put him in a situation where he might have to personally account for his decisions to someone who didn't drink the kool-aid. he just doesn't have the balls.

it's not about what kind of president Bush is - it's about what kind of man he is.

Boy you really have a thing about male genitalia lately.


Hope that back operation didn't have any adverse effects.





If Bush gives into this little scam there'd soon be scores of lying liberals squatting outside his ranch with their media lackeys.

Maybe the best thing would be for him to invite her into his ranch for a private meeting. She gets what she want's and the media gets squat.

Duh.

Gimme a break. :RE:

So, the parent's of dead soldiers are the only people whose opinions matter? Should we put them in charge of military operations in Iraq just 'cause they're grieving? Here's a better idea, leave the important decisions to the people who know what's really going on over there.

like every other Bush critic who has come forward, cindy sheehan gets slammed, slimed, and trashed by the GOP sleaze machine. but none of this obscures the truth: she's right - her son died for a lie, like every other iraq casualty. so, regardless of whatever you think her motives are, make no mistake: she has the moral high ground.

Got a link?

anatomy of the Sheehan sleaze attack, courtesy of Media Matters For America. the chronology is fascinating, documenting the synchronization of the right-wing websites (Drudge et al), rightie media wingnuts (O'Reilly, Malkin, Limbaugh), and conservative media (Fox). the GOP sleaze machine, in action:

conservatives are determined explorers. when you think they've hit bottom, they surprise you and go even farther down.

- js.

Can't you think for yourself knife? Instead of bloated quotes of what other people are saying just compare the statements in the full articles daddydirt posted. No crap about it being out of context then and it's pretty obvious.


If you can think for yourself that is.




Damn, the guy is psychic.

my reply took a while....I had to wait and make sure tk was finished editing his post
 

remember folks, Media Matters for America is a self-described "progressive" research and information center, not a "left-wing", "lefty" or "liberal" research and information center mind you, but progressive.

rejoice comrades, various "journalists" and "progressive (there's that word again) bloggers" are keeping an eye on the evil right-wing facists for you. :EA:


thanks albed, it's a shame that so many are so blinded by their hatred for Bush et al. that they can't or won't admit something so obvious.

L.A. Times Joins the Crowd in Distorting the Cindy Sheehan Story

don't get too carried away dissecting the tangential minutia in your search for talking points, fellas - try to keep your eye on the ball: her son died for a lie - she's earned the right to be where she is, asking the questions she's asking. period.

progressive = "left-wing", "lefty"
"liberal" = conservative

Yeah, lets not post any 4-page quotes about "tangential minutia" here, huh.


She didn't earn anything. All she did was squeeze a baby out of her vagina; big deal.


Trying to gain glory for what her adult son did with his own life already shows her moral level.


But let's not slam, slime and trash her by questioning her right to lie because, hey - her son died you know.

You couldn't be more offensive, albed, but you're on the right track.

She, like all families of military personell, shares a portion of her son's honor for his service. This of course gives her the right to be upset with the president for puting him in harm's way and she deserves some kind of explanation. But if he were my son I'd rather talk to his commanding officer or some other soldier who knew him better; the president would be the last person I'd go to for consolation. Ms. Sheehan's vendetta will only prolong her grief, it's unhealthy and I feel bad that she can't seem to get on with her life. But what's worse is that she's invoking the name of a dead family member to make a political statement. Rather than exploiting her son's death she should be celebrating his life.

I could be far more offensive Mazer. I've just been unusually nice lately.

Funny she's not voicing her sons opinions, just her own.

Don't you wonder why the press doesn't focus more on her son instead of on her?

Quite likely her sons politics were contrary to hers and she definitely opposed his service so she should be the last to share his honor and using his death for her own political purposes makes her just a little disgusting.

I see you recognize the exploitation; try to recognize how phony the claims of grieving are.

She already had her consolation time with President Bush and seemed quite content with it. Trying for a second one just reeks of political manipulation.

what a profoundly arrogant thing to say. how could you know this - that the son was in agreement with the administration's objectives and practices. or is it just an assumption on your part? for all you know he was just as angry with a fatally blundering washington as she is now. many serving in iraq are. in which case she is in fact speaking for him, and against those whose policies terminally exploited this soldier, and indeed she is celebrating his too short life. the burden of proof is not on mrs. sheehan. unless presented with strong eveidence to the contray one must assume a mother knows her own child. the burden of proof is on these strangely agitated pro-bush critics, who seem to think a few short lines in a year old story make them experts on this familly.

- js.

It's an opinion Jack. Try to sober up before you post so you can understand what's going on and make an intelligent reply.

fuck..my clock said 10 minutes...you're not abusing your mod powers are you? I don't see an edit notice.

lol @ "intelligent reply." albed your non-techincal posts are little more than schoolyard taunts. if you remove the insults from your comments there's nothing left but nouns. ;)

- js.

once you "quote" a post you freeze the text while you run out the clock, not the writer. he or she could make a change in 5 mins (or less) but if you hold your post up the clock can appear to run out. still, whether it's 5 minutes or 10 in this particular case any changes made were for style - not for debate positions - no points were altered. in the future you might want to wait a few minutes before jumping in, or, if it's that important to communicate instantly - try chat.

- js.

Jack........drunk...........idiot.

You're right.



I waited till my clock said 8:13 before starting my reply but it could be off a minute or two. I'm not complaining because your post was a little lamer originally.

wingnut catnip :CG:

If he sees that ad then he won't have to meet with her, she said it all.

Well,she looks like a raving Liberal.
Isn't there a law against people like her?
If not,there soon will be.
Asking the President questions indeed,
whatever next?

Seriously, who gives-a-fuck?

There's a thousand legitimate questions that President Bush should be answering - and he should be being asked them by a focused, serious media... But instead of asking them, we're stuck with this ridiculous circus act, where the questions are somehow ignored, in favour of 'continued coverage' of the baloney "David v Goliath" story that the news networks love to jerk off to, knowing that it can be drawn out over the course of a couple of weeks without actually tackling the reasons for the action. Of course she's being manipulated by 'the left'... of course it's a bullshit set-up! What did Sheehan or anyone else expect?

Cindy Sheehan can eat the dirt that the Presidential motorcade flicks up in her face. I dislike this populistic method of critique at the best of times (purely because it falls so easily into the hands of the info-tainment departments of every news channel) but when the detailed lies and abuses of power of Government are boiled down to a single issue of a protesters argument... ugh... no thankyou.

In such turbulent times, we need upstanding journalists who are prepared to grill politicians and ask questions that may lead to them being barred from press rooms. We need thorough, sober and hard-nosed critique, not another performing seal that will just add to the superficial bullshit of 'news coverage'.

a fair point, t-man, and well put, as always :W:

the fact is that 80% of the mileage that this story has gotten is because Cindy Sheehan is staging this protest in Crawford, Texas, in front of an army of media who have nowhere to go as long as the Prez is there and absolutely nothing else to report on. if she had done this anywhere else, the story would have come and gone by now. from a strictly pr point of view, one could say it was a very clever move on her part - guaranteed coverage.

that being said, if her little circus keeps the hard questions about the war on the front page and in the mind of the public, then this event, political theater though it may be, will have done some good. without question, the press has been asleep for years, but populist eruptions of sentiment can blow open doors that the press is not comfortable opening on thier own. if it takes a performing seal to get their attention, so be it. whatever it takes.

gee whiz, whose country is this? bush's, the press', the people's? if it's the people's then we need the cindy sheehans of this land, by the 1000's, by the 1,000,000's, to stand up and insist on accountability from thier elected representatives, if we ever hope to have a working democracy. i don't remember bush being forced to run for president or to take the oath of office. if citizens make him uncomfortable he should get over it - or resign, and let someone take over who appreciates what an amazing thing a peoples' democracy is supposed to be.

btw, i don't watch a lot of tv but i do watch a little each day and when i graze i see the usual crap still running like game shows, entertainment tonight, soap operas and the mindless morning "news" shows where slimey celebs slide from one channel to another plugging forgetable product. i'm not seeing wall to wall cindy tv by any means. i actually first learned about it here. if i hadn't seen knife's thread i would have only gotten a superficial taste on a shields/brooks debate last friday on the newshour, and they didn't spend a whole lot of time on it. this ain't no baby jessica fallen down the well. not by a long shot. now that was media circus.

- js.

I think she is dishonoring her son. If he didn’t want to go to war he shouldn’t have joined the military. When you are in the military you do what you are told, you do not ask questions. She has every right to protest and I can feel her pain, but I would never use the death of a Soldier, a Warrior for political gain, esp. my son.

What she can do is read UNSCR 1441, 678, & 660, the 12 years of noncompliance to UN resolutions.

The outcomes of war are not measured on the reasons the war began, but by what that war achieves. I think this can be said of every war, and we do not know what this war will achieve yet. At the end of each war, there was still no perfection. When the civil war ended, the freed slaves did not have true freedom and equality because they were degraded by those who felt they were inferior, regardless of the emancipation proclamation. At the end of WWII, it was the beginning of the cold war as the USSR took territories in Europe and created huge enslaved states. In every war, another struggle began and that is the truth for Iraq.

A quote from Cindy, “Am I emotional? Yes, my first born was murdered. Am I angry?

Yes, he was killed for lies and for a PNAC Neo-Con agenda to benefit Israel. My son joined the Army to protect America, not Israel.”

He was protecting America Cindy, and he was helping to spread freedom, something many of us take for granted.

Republic Jack, The USA is a Republic and it works just fine.....

this, of course, is a marketing slogan for the war that has no discernable basis in fact.

been drinking the kool-aid again, have we?:drk:

Seen any terrorists attacks in the US lately knife?

Heard of any more mass murders in Iraq like the ones Saddam committed while the UN was sucking up oil for food bribes?

Your nearsightedness combined with your selective memory means you miss or forget many relevant occurrences or their absence.

I know what you mean, but I guess I just dislike 'reality tv' razzamatazz.
I suspect that when one sacrifices the content of an argument for the benefit of greater volume or exposure, you open yourself to the ravages of the varying media agendas - and none of them include pressurising Government... at least, not to the point of discomfort. I hope that Ms Sheehan's actions will keep the 'difficult questions' in the public's gaze (and maybe I was a little harsh in my opinion), but I doubt it will provide anythig more than tabloid titilation.

:shead:

still think you're living in ancient greece sinner? you’re obviously not living here. the us is a democracy and as for it's health, that issue is clearly a matter of great debate. sorry but your slogan is as unsubstantiated as it is superficial.


"Democracy is a form of government in which policy is decided by the preference of the majority in a decision-making process, usually elections or referendum, open to all or most citizens. It is now commonly used as a synonym for liberal-democratic systems in nation- states. Most of these are parliamentary representative democracies, but there are many varieties of democracy, some still hypothetical. In recent years, definitions of democracy have broadened to include aspects of society and political culture in democratic societies, which are not a 'form of government'. The term 'democratic' is also used in a looser sense, to describe participatory decision-making in groups or organisations."

from wiki

"Democracies fall into two basic categories, direct and representative.

Today, the most common form of democracy, whether for a town of 50,000 or nations of 50 million, is representative democracy, in which citizens elect officials to make political decisions, formulate laws, and administer programs for the public good. In the name of the people, such officials can deliberate on complex public issues in a thoughtful and systematic manner that requires an investment of time and energy that is often impractical for the vast majority of private citizens."

from the us department of state.

- js.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States

The United States of America—also referred to as the United States, the USA, the US, America, the States (colloquially), and Columbia (poetically)—is a democratic, federal republic of 50 states.


Fuck Jack this is high school stuff. Ever say the pledge of allegiance?


http://www.answers.com/republic&r=67

#

1. A political order whose head of state is not a monarch and in modern times is usually a president.
2. A nation that has such a political order.

Wrong Jack... One is Rule by Law the other is Rule by Majority....


Constitution of the United States of America
Article IV

Section. 4.

The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government, and shall protect each of them against Invasion; and on Application of the Legislature, or of the Executive (when the Legislature cannot be convened), against domestic Violence.


also read --- Federalist Paper #10 by James Madison

Oh man, not this tired discussion agian. :RE:

Tambs, you weren't too hash on the media for their dilution of the message. In my opinion people should question the media every bit as much as the media questions the government. Unfortunatly info-tainment drives up advertisement revenues, and as long as it's more profitable to toss softball questions at this or any administration then that's what they're going to do.

I blame this all on the Screenwriter's Guild strike a few years ago. Because of them TV producers couldn't get anybody to write a decent fictional show so they hoarked up a bunch of reality TV shows to fill the voids in their fall line-ups. Now the news agencies think they have to make real life compete with TV reality, and the only way to do that is to fake it up and make it look semi-scripted. The reporters there in Crawford are probably coaching Ms. Sheehan the way reality TV producers coach their 'contestants' off camera. If it weren't for them and their support (read: instigation) she would have given up after the first week.

he can paste but he can't think.

- js.

ditto.

labels like definitions migrate and change in time. what we have here in the u.s. we call a democracy. as well as by the people it is defined as such by the united states government. canada may be another story. if you have a problem with a living language get out your quills and send a pigeon to chaucer.

- js.

The authoritative references define the US as a Republic as you've seen Jack. You, of course, can call it whatever you want, just as you've done in the past.



http://www.p2p-zone.com/underground/...60&postcount=4

http://www.p2p-zone.com/underground/...9&postcount=59
Seems you actually do know the proper term. Maybe you just forget it on occasion and need to make something up.

Be sure to bring up the subject in your next campaign so the ignorant trailer trash will know you're one of them and not one of those educated, booklearned, city folk.

you have learned a great lesson grasshopper: if jack says it must be true.


unlike you i’m not arguing for rigid definitions – i'm arguing against them. nowhere did i deny a republic. the country was founded by those whose idealized versions of political platforms borrowed heavily from the ancient greeks. 200 years later the differences are lost to many and we say, and yes the united states government says, we have a democracy. bush & co aren’t sending our fair girls and boys to die in iraq to install a republic, not in speeches i heard on any campaign trails, whether thru manicured fields of grecian palaces or rutted roads of rusting trailer parks. a distinction lost on you perhaps, since this is connecticut, and our mobiile homes are worth more than your mcmansions.

- js.

Well until they amend the Constitution, I will call your form of Government a Democratic Republic. You can be as condescending has you want too, it won’t change my mind. I never was one to follow the crowd. Oh, and it is different here in Canada, Canada has a Socialist Government.

Sorry Mazer, went off topic.

I watched Cindy last night in an interview with Anderson Cooper on CNN and I have to say she really is not an intelligent person. She avoided the tuff questions and really doesn’t know what she is talking about. I think she is either a racist or somebody’s puppet. She absolutely does not deserve a second meeting with George W. Bush.

Grieving Bush Protestor Has No Exit Strategy
by Scott Ott

(2005-08-16) -- Cindy Sheehan, the protestor whose son died fighting for freedom in Iraq, today acknowledged that she has "no exit strategy" for getting out of what some have called the "quagmire in Crawford" outside of the Texas ranch of President George Bush.

"My opponent is more entrenched than I expected," said Mrs. Sheehan, whose vigil has focused national attention on the ability of the news media to focus national attention on Mrs. Sheehan. "I'm still committed to victory, but it may take longer than I thought at first."

Mrs. Sheehan said she is willing to "pay any price, bear any burden" to get a second meeting with Mr. Bush.

http://abcnews.go.com/International/...ory?id=1044611



Woman sets herself on fire protesting Israel's Gaza Strip withdrawal.

hint-hint-hint

I saw a little: '- army bases the size of Sacramento in Iraq'. She lives in California so she should know how big Sacramento is. She just doesn't know what the hell she's talking about. Not by a long shot.

yet somehow she effortlessly manages to make the Prez look like a shmuck, every day that she's out there. this in turn drives the wing nuts crazy and they work overtime to bury her in sleaze:

my my - all that vitriol and all she did was refuse to grieve quietly after her son got killed. it's a shame the right can't get that worked up about stuff that really matters.

Excluded by theknife:
"Last year, the President met with Mrs. Sheehan, comforted her, and grieved with her. At the time, Mrs. Sheehan thought the President had done well and appreciated him. Enter August, no major news, and a media still smarting over the President's re-election despite everything they threw at him. Cindy Sheehan returns entering stage right -- this time a left wing media whore in the form of a grieving mother."

"While Casey's grandparents, aunts, uncles, and numerous cousins having issued a statement saying Sheehan "now appears to be promoting her own personal agenda and notoriety at the the expense of her son's good name and reputation,"


Man, what a smear knife! From her own relatives no less.


"Concurrently, the media and the left ignore those parents of the fallen who are offended by Mrs. Sheehan, support the President, or otherwise recognize that Mrs. Sheehan's actions discredit and undermine the work so many fallen soldiers works hard for. Those people just do not make the story flow like the left wants."


Really selective coverage wouldn't you say? But you're pretty selective yourself. Good link though, thorough and accurate.

she's like the teflon leftie.... nothing sticks on her because nothing can challenge her fundamental legitamacy: her son died for a lie. i think deep down, the radical right knows this and it scares them - why else would they get so hysterical about her?

Yep. They're so hysterical they go around shouting:

"HEY EVERYONE LOOK AT ME, I'M GRIEVING!"

"BANG-BANG-BANG" "HEY MASS MEDIA COME OUT AND LOOK AT ME GRIEVING OVER HERE!"

"ALL YOU LEFT WING RADICALS COME TO TEXAS AND JOIN ME WHILE I'M GRIEVING."




She makes people hysterical alright. :PAL:

What lie, knife?

well, since you asked...

there is The Big Lie, which is how i've come to fondly regard the Iraq War, which is characterized by a whole bunch of smaller lies, such as those listed below:

:PE: